Friends & Fiction
Friends & Fiction

Episode · 1 year ago

Frinds & Fiction with Alice Hoffman and the launch celebration for Patti Callahan's Once Upon a Wardrobe

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

F&F welcomes bestselling author Alice Hoffman. The crew discuss the brand new fourth installment in Alice's acclaimed and beloved Practical Magic series, THE BOOK OF MAGIC (an instant NYT bestseller). They also talk about magic and fairy tales and witches, about the different skills invloved in writing fiction, non-fiction, screenplays, and magical realism, and they talk about Alice's work for breast cancer resarch and treatment. Then they shitft gears to celebrate Patti Callahan's new book ONCE UPON A WARDROBE. Hear about Patti's research and inspration, her passion for all things CS Lewis and Narnia, and about the power of imagination and stories to bring us hope and a deeper understanding of our world.

Welcome to friends and fiction for new york times, bestselling authors, endless stories, novelists, mary Kay andrews. Kristen Harmel, Christie Woodson harvey and paddy Callaghan Henry R four longtime friends with more than 70 published books between them together, they host friends and fiction with author interviews and fascinating insider talk about publishing and writing to highlight and support independent bookstores. They discussed the books, they have written the books they're reading now and the art of storytelling. If you love books and you're curious about the writing world, you're in the right place. Hello everyone. It is Wednesday night and that means it's time for the happiest hour and tonight the most magical night of the week. Friends and fiction. Welcome to our show. We have so much to look forward to tonight. I am patty Callahan and I'm mary Kay Andrews, I'm Christine Harmel and I am Christy Willson Harvey and tonight y'all it is about magic, the magic of stories of fantastic lands and snowy forests of the launch of Once Upon a wardrobe of the magic of our incredible guest Alice Hoffman and her magic series culminating this month with the book of magic the fourth about the Owens family. But before we dive in remember we started friends in fiction to support indie bookstores and we have partnered with warrants and beautiful la Joya California as our featured indie bookseller through the end of october works as the country's oldest continuously family owned and operated bookstore. So we see them as an ideal partner for our mission. We are going to keep encouraging you to shop local and shop small by buying from works all month long and we will be offering you special opportunities along the way browser selection which includes the friends and fiction host books as well as latest as by tonight's guest Alice Hoffman. If you order either Alice or patties book from work tonight you'll receive an exclusively designed wooden bookmark before we get into our show. We have to take a second to have a celebration because yesterday a wardrobe launch something I can do this a hit number eight. We have so much to celebrate so we're so excited for her on your copy of Once Upon a wardrobe. Yet now another minute. It is amazing and fabulous kristen. Are you drinking champagne? Did we give you that mental? I am Christy. Can you just pour taught me off maybe long. Just snow little We'll give you a road. Thanks. I mean just put it through the screen. I just you know, here is the subway happy pub week. Well speaking of Once Upon a wardrobe, we know you all know we have a regular column for Parade magazine and this week's essay written by patty is all about fairy tales and why they're still so important today. It's about the allure of the words Once upon a Time and what that does to us how a proposal for a night like tonight as we celebrate two weavers of fairy tale magic patty. Can you tell us a little bit about the essay you wrote? I ask are we too old for fairy tales, Do they still matter? Because as Lewis, the author of the Lion the Witch and the wardrobe says sometimes fairy stories say best what needs to be said. So, I wrote a little bit about why this is true, how these kind of stories, including Alice Hoffman's book with magic, how they affect our lives. You can find literary theory and you can find definition galore. But isn't a fairy tale different for each of us. They invite us into imaginary worlds so that we can better understand this world. When I go to a fairy tale, I set out for one destination and arrive at another completely. They hold all these emotional truce and they blend the real and the fantastic and more importantly they are enchanting. So at our after show party tonight we are going to hear everyone's favorite fairy tales and childhood tales and we will have some special Poppin guests to talk about them too. But I cannot wait to hear what Alice Hoffman says about all of...

...this as she writes very much about the impact of fairy tales. So, I know we don't have to but I am going to tell you a bit about Alice Hoffman Three. Alice Hoffman is the best selling author of over 30 novels, three books of short fiction and eight books for Children and young adults, Alice wrote her first novel property of at the age of 21. While she was studying at Stanford, her work has been published in more than 20 translations in more than 100 foreign editions. Several of her novels have been recognized as notable books of the year by the New York Times Entertainment Weekly Library Journal and people magazine. Her novel practical magic was made into a Warner brothers film starring Sandra Bullock and Nicole Kidman Kidman Alice also wrote the original screenplay for Independence Day, a film starring Dianne Wiest and Kathleen Quinlan. I'm gonna have to go back and watch practical manage like that. It's so good. So I loved that movie. Yeah, so good Alice grew up on Long Island and currently lives in boston. She donated her advance from local girls which is a collection of interconnected stories about love and loss on Long Island to help create the Hoffman breast center at Mount Auburn Hospital in Cambridge, massachusetts. The fourth and final novel in Alice's practical magic series. The Book of Magic was released. This was released last week and we are so happy to have her sean, could you bring Alison? Okay, Magic is afoot. Welcome Alice. It is such a thrill to have you. But before we get started we all have something to say. Ready. Congratulations, thank you so much and congratulations. Thank you. So I have read so much of your work and the marriage of opposites was my gateway to your novels and the fourth in the magic series. The Book of Magic just came out. So, if you could tell everyone out there just a little bit about the book and where we are in this series and something about the new one. Yeah, well, I I wrote practical magic 25 years ago and I never thought I would write about those characters of that family again. And then I started to get letters and notes from readers saying that they wanted more and they wanted to sequel. And I, I don't know, it took me 25 years or so to 20 years to do it. And I decided I didn't want to write a sequel. I really wanted to write a prequel because I'm interested in going back in time, kind of, family histories are really fascinating to me. So I wrote um The next book I wrote was called the Rules of Magic, which takes place in New York City in 19, in the 1960s. And then after that I wrote a book called Magic lessons which goes back to the 17th century and it's kind of the origin story and now this is the book of Magic is the last in the series. And the last Owens Family book, which was kind of sad for me. But also I felt like there was closure and I had had the really good fortune to have these characters with me for almost 25 years. Sad for the reader to Alice Sad for the reader to have to be in the last one. Oh well, thanks. But you know, I feel like there's kind of closure when you're I think there needs to be closed. You know, it doesn't feel that we would like a single novel that can end where it ends. But once you start having, you know, many novels about the same family, it feels like for me it felt like there had to be some sort of closure for the family and for the readers and also for me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well your opening line in the book of magic is so pitch perfect and I remember I read it really late at night and I wanted more than anything to text our friend Ron Block who is our rock star librarian that runs our podcast. But um some stories begin at the beginning and others begin at the end, but all the best stories begin in a library. So good, so good. So this series began, what was your original spark for this fascinating Owen's family, you know, I'm not exactly sure, but the way I really started what was I have a list of titles that like a running list of titles, a title called practical magic. And I just said this is a book, I, I don't know what the book is, but I think it's a book and I'd always been interested in in, which is, you know, actually I was cleaning out my house during Covid and getting everything together. And I stumbled upon my oldest drawing that I remember making in first grade, but I didn't remember this and it was a drawing of a witch with a black cat in a bat, very, you know, typical witch. But I thought, you know, I had like the same subject matter of my whole life. And so, you know, I wasn't surprised me that when the own...

...family turned out to be witches, that's amazing. So did you, I think you sort of answered this, but you didn't always mean to necessarily make this into a series or write 1/4 book? No, not at all. I mean if I had thought I was going to make it to a series, I would have done it in a much smarter way and had an outline of a plan for all the books, but that's that's really not what happened. You know, it was kind of a hodgepodge because I didn't think I would be doing it. Thanks, wow. So Alice, I would love to talk to you about the word magic and how it enchants us all. So very much you as your tagline says, blend the real and the Fantastic. Which goes to your oft quoted line books are the only true magic. So since we're talking about magic tonight, what is magic to you? How would you define it? Well, for me in my life, it really has been books and literature and writing and being a reader, I feel the magic for me was when I first went to a library and I had the freedom to choose any book that I wanted and to read anything that I wanted. And also for me growing up where I did, where there wasn't there wasn't much hope. It gave me hope and that there was another world and other possibilities. It kind of opened the world in the best way and I think in the most magical way, I love that. I feel like that's what magic does open. So your fairy tales and all of this, they opened these new worlds to us as patty said earlier. Um you also write in the Ice Queen, every fairy tale had a bloody lining I'm so interested in that. Can you talk to us about that line and how fairy tales and which is as you said, which is have always um interested you can you talk a little bit about how fairy tales in which is interested inspire you? Well, you know, there are some people that think that nobody under the age of eight should be read fairy tales or should read fairy tales because they're really brutal stories. They're very emotionally true and psychologically true. I think that's why I love them as a kid because I just when I was growing up a lot of kids literature kind of talked down to you and very calls never talked down to. And um you know, the other thing is with the bloody lining is that I always feel like there's like an outside story and an inside story when you're writing a novel. So the outside story, you know, usually know the inside story reveals itself to as you're writing, usually sometimes don't know what you're writing about until you're in the process or until you finish sometimes that's a good point. That's kind of a little bit magical to. Absolutely. Um why do you think little girls are interested in? Which is why why do you think which is appeal to um girls into women? I've read you talking about how, which is are the only female mythic figures that have power. And I think that's such an interesting statement. Is that something that that you that you still feel and that you kind of draw on when you're working on these books? I think it's I think it's really true. I mean, certainly when I was growing up at Halloween, you could be either a princess or which that was pretty much wow with the Bride Alyssa, I think that's kind of the I always wanted to be a witch. But even now, you know, when little girls have options and there are other characters they could be, I mean, everybody still wants to be a witch. So I think, you know, it's exactly that, you know that the witches is the character is the mythic character that has some power. And one of the interesting things I read recently that I forget the exact percentage, but something like 80 or 85% of the heroes in Fairy Tales are girls. And that's really not true statistically of other stories. So, you know, I think for all of us, I have never heard that percentage in a fairy tale. When I was writing that essay was doing all this research on fairy tales. And one of the fascinating things was how many things they have been called through the ages, Wonder Tales, Dream Tales, folk tales. But I've never heard that that percentage have been women. That is fascinating. And you know, it's also interesting that some of the most famous, you know, collectors of fairy tales are men and that they kind of co opted and corrupted the stories to be what they wanted it to be. So that the kind of image of the witches of like the ugly old crone or something big Works always works. Yeah, yeah. Or the wicked stepmother is probably a creation. Yeah. The Wicked Stepmother. Well, sometimes that's, that happens. I, you know, I love the Children's class in college and we studied the original Grimm's Brothers versions of fairy tales. And uh, you would not want contemporary Children to read those...

...because for instance, in Cinderella, the evil step sisters, I mean, one of them who puts on the slippers dances to her death because they're made out of fire and the birds pluck out their eyes. Yeah they're grim. They really are grim. Well they're you know they're very brutal fairy tales. Yeah. And then Disney cleaned him up and make money off. Yeah. Alice you've written so many different types of fiction and nonfiction as well as the screenplay for the 1983 film Independence Day with Kathleen Quinlan. Not to be confused with the 96 film of the same name. Will smith. Yeah with Will smith. Would you talk to us about going back and forth between solid realism and magical realism? Is that process different And how do you choose your subject? I have a lot of questions. A lot of questions. So is is that a different process? How do you choose your subject And how do you see saw back and forth between those different genres and stories? Well I don't see myself as a writer of realism and I I find that realism is kind of the new kid on the block. That the that the that literature really is is more magical, contained more magic up until recently. Um So and I really you know, I don't like the kind of putting things into genres because I think it's a way to devalue them as not literature? You know if it's fantasy, it's not literature I think that's all changing sort of a little. Yeah but certainly when I was growing up, you know there was like fantasy and science fiction and there was mystery and you know, then there was literature and um literature was usually written by men and um so you know, I think for me I was a screenwriter for a long time for about 25 years and you know, it's just such a different process than than being a novelist where you kind of in charge of things and being a screenwriter, your you can be very easily replaced and you know, there could be three screenwriters on a project. Just a very different process and you know, a novel just belongs to you and the reader, you know, basically, do you ever feel um schizophrenic going back and forth in my life? I think all writers are schizophrenic we live in are we live in our head and then we have to go out in the real world and buy groceries and get our cars tuned up? Yeah. I always thought like what are other people thinking about when they're like in line waiting for their coffee? You know, I love you. So what do you think about, what do you think about? Yeah, I don't know. I think about that all the time when I'm falling off to sleep. I'm wondering I wonder what somebody else thinks about where they're going to sleep? My best ideas come in the shower. So I always wonder, well, is everybody else in the shower just showering. Yeah, mine too. I mean that's a great place for some reason. Your mind is just so freed or driving when you're like on a long run driving? Always. Yeah. Oh my gosh, that's hilarious. It's so true. I have thought that so many times. Alice. I watched that in conversation you had with matt Haig. It was so yeah, he he's amazing. I love his new book and the Midnight Library. I just love that book. And you know, it's funny that book would have been great no matter what. But the fact that it came out during Covid, it was just the perfect time because when I read it, I was so depressed than the day I picked it up and I had like really loved his work before. But this book is just spectacular. And I felt compelled to write to him after I read the book because I felt so much better after Midnight Library. It's just a terrific book. And and it's just so interesting. You know, the idea of it of you know what if you what if you could live these different lives? It offered so much hope. Don't you think? I just heard you call it an antidote to despair. And I 100% agree. I think it really is wonderful. But in that conversation, I heard you say that writing a book is often writing a message to yourself and it is a way of telling the truth to yourself. So did that happen with this fourth book in the Magic Series? You know, it just happened to me this morning actually when I was writing, I'm just like, oh my God, this is what the book is bad. I had no idea. Um yeah, I think, you know, it was a little bit different with the book of magic because I knew the family so well and I knew so much about them. Yes. But what I realized when I was writing it, it's really about breaking...

...a curse. The family has this curse, which, you know, if if any of them fall in love, then the person they're in love with will meet with a horrible untimely death. And I realized, you know, so many families hand down these legacies of trauma in one way or another, you know, and I think that's part of like why people are so interested in genealogy and going back in history and trying to kind of figure out who they are, why they are the way they are. And I realized, you know, that was, you know, really what the book was about. I um I feel like every time I write a book, I come away with something I didn't think I was writing about. Yeah, I think that's the inside story on the outside story, right? You think, you know, when you have an outline or whatever and then all of a sudden you realize there's something inside of there that you're trying to tell yourself. And I really always think that writers, novelists are writing books for themselves, you know? Yes. Their message this. Well, there's that quote from the lucy Barton book, Elizabeth stroud about where the writing teacher says, don't worry about what story you're going to write. We all only have one and we just find different ways to tell it. And I've always loved. Yeah, she's such a great writer. Yeah, she's amazing. So this book is called The Book of Magic, but there are also books of magic in the Book of Magic. And in your author note, you talk about Amelia Bassano Lanier, the first woman in England to publish a volume of poems who was fictionalized in the novel Amelia Bassano and has been rumored to have written a lot of Shakespeare's work. So, can you tell us a little bit more about her and how she inspired some of the book of Magic? Yeah, I didn't know there was a novel about her. But yeah, she she is in she figures in magical essence in the 17th century. And then again in the book of Magic. And as she said, she was the first woman in Britain to publish a book of poems, you know, really got nothing for it. There's all kinds of rumors. She was she was a came from a family of jews from venice um jews were not lead in England for hundreds of years nor in any place else in europe. And um there are rumors that she was a dark lady that Shakespeare wrote about it and there are rumors that she actually wrote the plays because she was the mistress of the person who was in charge of all theatricals in London. And she was involved with Christopher Marlowe who who may or may not have taught her how to write a play. Um, but it's kind of an interesting idea. And she writes this book in in my book, she also writes a book of dark magic, kind of a book of revenge for everything she didn't get and everything she wanted. And my characters find this book and it's kind of like a witches journal called The grim War and um and it leads them to places they wouldn't have otherwise gone too. So, you know, I think she's a very interesting character in that, you know, her life would have been so different had she been a man of course, of course. And when I said she's fictionalized in the novel, I meant your novel. Oh, she's actualizing your novel. Yeah, I mean, she's not so much a character as she is kind of a voice and a writer Well and she's an inspiration for the Owens, right? Yeah, to go. But she's also it's also she's also kind of a warning. Yes, she's very, very um she's so wounded and so hurt that her magic is very dark. I want to ask about the left hand and right hand magic that is without any spoilers. You divide the dark magic and the light of magic into left hand and right hand. Tell me a little bit about how that came about from your research. Yeah. Well, I mean, that is what, you know, black magic is called this left handed magic. And uh left hand is has been long thought of to be, you know, kind of evil in some ways. And left handed people, sorry if anybody's left handed, it's not like right the role. She's just telling girls. I'm just telling it. And my father is. Yeah, it's funny. Yeah. Well, I think that's one of the reasons they tried to make left handed people be right handed. You know, that's what they used to do back in the day is, you know, tie your left hand down so that you had to use your right hand. Um, so I don't know. I think that there are, you know, you know, you know, there's good and evil. The world is split into light and darkness and especially, you know, when we talk about myths. So that's part of what happens. Do you have your own library of books of magic? Because I know they're real, they're out in the world fascinating. I do. I do. I mean, I have research, I have research books. I don't want to have a...

...witches book because, you know, with the witches journal is supposed to be burned when when when she does unless it's passed down to a family member because it's private. It's personal. And you know, you just don't want your magic getting out there to just anyone. So fascinating, so fascinating. Alice, we've been talking a lot about literal magic tonight, right? Like the magic you write about. But you know, we were talking about this before we went on the show and I think you've done something really truly magical in your own life with the founding of the Hoffman Cancer Center. Can you talk a little bit about that? Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah, Can you talk a little bit about that and and and kind of what your experience was leading up to that and what made you bring that into the world? Yeah, well, I had breast cancer I think about 25 years ago. I'm I'm kind of blocking it out exactly when I think it was 1998 actually was just when the movie practical magic was being made, so that I was just because I was otherwise engaged. But in the hospital that I went to, which is a great hospital to Harvard teaching hospital, but they didn't have a breast center. So you just kind of sat there with everybody else while you're waiting for your radiation, you're sitting next to some kid who broke his arm playing baseball. It was just like, it was not the most comfortable thing. And when I was when I was done with my treatment, I was so grateful, I asked my friends there who were doctors, you know, what could I do? And They said, you know, do something local. And so we created together working together the center. And for, I think the past 20 years it might be 25 years. We've had a writer's event every year and have raised quite a lot of money. And writers have been so generous and given of their time, so amazingly. So, you know, it's just it's been a great experience to be involved with it. Well, that's awesome. Count us in in the future if you ever need us, what it means, it means something to all of us to um, you know, Alice, we were also talking a little bit earlier about the decision about whether or not to share that experience and how it's difficult, you know, it's a difficult choice. How much of yourself do you share when you're going through something like that? But ultimately, you wrote about your experience, a memoir form and you have shared it now very broadly. What what brought you to that point where you felt like you were ready to do that? Well, I really didn't tell many people were talking about that before. And then, you know, I think, like, the next after a year after my treatment, I wrote an article in the new york times about it. And um, my family members found out about it that way. And then I wrote a book called Survival lessons, just a very small book, which I felt like was the book that I wished someone could have given to me, you know, when I was first diagnosed because mostly I just really wanted to talk to survivors and to know that you know, it was possible to survive and um so you know, I I feel like you know, I'm kind of a private Person for the first like 20 or so years when I was a writer, I never even told anyone, I was a writer never. And you know, I just feel actually being involved with the center has made it easier for me to talk about certain things and certainly to talk about cancer, but growing up, especially growing up for me, you know, you know, that was something you just didn't talk about. So it was partially by being private and not wanting to have an interfere with my work, but I think it was partially the way I had grown up was that you know, you just don't talk about these things. Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. Okay, Ellis, most of our viewers and we admit us, one of our favorite parts of the show is to ask our guests for writing tip and trust me, All four of us are leaning forward to hear yours so well I have a few but the one I think is the most important is one that my writing Professor Albert Girard gave to me, which was a great blessing and it was that, you know, most writing teachers will tell you write what, you know, and he always said write what you can imagine. And that was I recommend that to everyone, especially to young writers don't feel like you have to tell the story of your life in fictional form. You can do whatever you want to do if you can feel it, you can write it. So we have a lot of live questions coming in and everyone is asking what you're working on next. I well, you know, I'm always afraid to talk about it too much and I know, you know, because somehow that magically we'll do something, but I'm writing a book that's biblical. So it's completely different. Um I wrote The Dove Keepers, which was which was kind of my biblical book are what was post biblical, but this is even further back in time. And so it's been really fun and interesting for me to do the research and to write about that time period. Oh my gosh, whatever it is, we cannot wait. We...

...cannot wait. Well in the marriage of opposites you wrote about a real person is the one you're working on a real person. Well who knows, you know, back, you know, it was so long ago, who who knows what's the story, what's a fairy tale and what was really, you know, it's hard, it's true? What's an origin story and what's a what's a stable Exactly. Thank you so much for joining us with your very particular and enchanting kind of magic. Your new book is the spellbinding lee good book. And I'm sad. I already read it because I wish I had it ahead of me because I've read all four and I'm going to miss Jet and I'm going to miss the O. N sisters and I'm going to miss Black tears. I'm going to miss all of it. We can go watch practical magic again. Let's do that tonight. Tonight. Thanks Great to talk to you. Thanks for joining. Congratulations. Oh, fantastic. Amazing. Okay. Are you all ready for the virtual launch party of Once Upon a wardrobe with a giveaway at the after party and loads of fun. I now hand over the reins of the sleigh to Kristen Harmel. I get to drive a sleigh. This is this is yeah, I haven't had too much to drink tonight. I'm safe. I'm good. I forgot my jingle bells, but I'm all right. You guys this night could not get any better. First Alice Hoffman and now paddy Callaghan, our dear friend and Friends and fiction co founder who has written a beautiful masterpiece that brings alive the Wintry world of Oxford and Worcester England, Is that how you say it was a western Worcester? Okay, so let's all walk through the wardrobe door to find out more. And just a reminder after we finished talking with pad tonight, the fund will continue in the after show with special guests and a giveaway. So you won't want to miss that. Alright, so to start off our wardrobe celebration patty, I would love to know a bit about why you knew Alice Hoffman was going to be the perfect guest to share the stage with you tonight as we talked about magic. Can you tell us a little bit about that and about your book? Okay, when I first read Alice Hoffman and the way that she combined the real and the fantastic, it reminded me so much of all my favorite fairy tales and yet it was grounded in this kind of, you didn't disbelieve it, you were right there with her and when I was writing Once upon a wardrobe and she mentioned it tonight about origin stories. And I love that she said that that she wrote an origin story for her story and I was fascinated with the origin stories of our favorite stories. So, I will give you the plot of Once Upon a wardrobe really quick. It is winter of 1950 and there was a young boy named George who lives in a stone cottage in Worcester England, right along the river Severn. It is the month of October exactly 71 years ago. This week in real life when a small boat burst onto the scene, It was called the lion the Witch and the wardrobe. And George read it front to back and back to front and he hidden his wardrobe and he really wanted to find the magical land on the other side. He has a sister who is a math and physics genius and she comes home for the weekend and she attends Oxford University and he says to her I know that the writer of this book teaches at your university, I need you to track him down and I need you to ask him where did this magical land come from? And she says that's ridiculous. That's absurd. The world is founded on math and logic and physics. And Einstein is about to discover the theory of everything and he begs her and she loves him. And she tracks down the author C. S. Lewis and he doesn't answer her the way we hope he does. He answers her with stories oh my gosh I've read this book, I've loved this book. Um but to hear you talk about it now is giving me those just goose bumps and chills and all the good ways. And I want to go back and read it again. I mean it really is. Um it's just so magical. But before we dive into the rest of your book for all of you watching out there we have a question for you, we would like to know...

...what was your favorite fairy tale as a child and why? So you can put your answer in the comments on either facebook or youtube. If you're watching us live tonight and we will pick a random winner and announce it in the after show. You will win this gorgeous custom made candle called through the wardrobe by the paris market in Savannah. Oh my gosh! We're drove into Narnia. Oh, that's beautiful. I absolutely love it. Did it, what did it smell like you guys? I haven't, I know you were just, oh my gosh, great. Oh my gosh! It smells like a magical woodland. I'm not kidding. It's like I win. If I put it in the comments fall holiday candle you've ever smelled. We loved it in the car last night. We had them in the car after he came back from our savannah event. And this morning when we got in the car, the car smelled like a spell it, a car. You know, it's like old cigarette smoke. It is pine amber and sugar plum. Oh my gosh, that sounds amazing. Well that would be such a great prize. And all you have to do to win is just tell us your favorite fairy tale and why And for anyone who orders once upon a wardrobe from Warwick's tonight, that's our bookseller of the night or bookseller of the month, you will be sent a beautiful wooden bookmark. So if you think about it, we can all be winners each and every one of us. I do hope you'll pick up the book which would make a great holiday gift to. So even if you have it for yourself um you know the book plus that bookmark would be a beautiful thing to give to somebody for the holidays this year. All right. So now without further ado let's get started patty, you were in the hot seat of my little slay operation Central. I'm ready. I'm not scared over here. I'm not scared, scared. I know they want to find a wardrobe. It's about a lot of things. But at its court starts with the question where do stories come from? I don't even have to look at my notes to know that that yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um So can you tell us what the origins were for your story three? It is interesting to talk about the origins of my story when my story is about the origins of another story. It's very uh you know anyone who watches Friends and fiction knows that I am consistently fascinated about the origins of stories about the first seat of a story. Where do stories come from? Where do they begin? And then how do they turn into what they turn into? And when I was writing becoming mrs Lewis which is about the improbable love story of C. S. Lewis and his fiery, courageous, fascinating, complicated wife, Joy David Hman. I saw all these little nuggets of his life inside my favorite childhood book and I started to think about how so much of our lives as authors and maybe one day it would be a fascinating episode to talk about what parts of our lives have shown up in novels because sometimes people see things we don't like, oh that episode or the way you think about that and they see it and we don't. And I wondered how much of what of his life that ended up in this book that has endured for generations? If he how much was conscious and how much it was unconscious, how much is conscious or unconscious for him and how much is conscious or unconscious for us and then the magical part, how no matter how many things we can point to, there is this large swath of story source that is completely ineffable, completely unexplainable and completely mystical. And that was the origin for this story. Was my wondering about how these stories come to be and how much of our life isn't it, and how much of pure ineffable magic is in them. Wow! Well I also think you know there are people who might see this book and think oh I have to go back and read once uh language in the wardrobe or I don't know enough about C. S. Lewis. So do you have to have any kind of background knowledge and C. S. Lewis to read this. Absolutely not the best way I can compare it to is that the lion the witch and the wardrobe is a vehicle for the story. So it doesn't matter what vehicle we use. It is a story about story, it is a story about how we tell stories especially the ones that endure. I am constantly fascinated by Miss because they're the ones that stick with us and kind of define how we look at life and this is one of those because even if you've never read the lion the witch and the wardrobe, you know who Azlan is and you know who the white witches because they're archetypes and I was interested in that. So you absolutely need to have zero...

...knowledge of the Lion the witch and the wardrobe. Read it. You should go read. Yes um becoming mrs Lewis. Oh absolutely were companions. Absolutely. You know I I will second that about I I have not read C. S. Lewis since I was a kid. I have not read read the language in the wardrobe since I was a kid. I really don't have any memory of it and that did not in any way impact how much I enjoyed this book. I thought it was beautiful and the story was really you know the story was the story of of George and and Meg's right I mean at the heart it was their story The brother and the sister. Um and and then the C. S. Lewis of it all was almost um just this extra element that kind of brings them closer and brings magic into their lives. I felt like it was you know when you read like historical fiction and then you go back like you read surviving savannah and you go back and you're like I want to research more about this shit. I feel like you read once upon a wardrobe and you're like oh I'm going to go back and read the line which in the wardrobe is like supplementary reading material. That's a good point. Okay patty, we ask Alice what is magic to you and she has to be the mistress of magic. Contemporary magic. So the allure of the words Once upon a Time were fairy tales for magic realism which of those were important to you or we're both of them important to you as a child. I was uh like all of us here we were all bookworms, right? Like it's the way I understood life. Life when life wasn't making any sense. A book made sense when life was confusing. A book worked out in the end, Laura ingalls Wilder found her way out of the blizzard and you know the world nancy drew found the clue in the clock and always. Well meg came down out of the attic to see her sisters and always. Well so those are the things that end up coming full circle in a story when they weren't coming full circle in my life. But reading some of the more magical tales like the Lion and the Witch and the wardrobe. It wasn't just about finding places of magic and enchantment, it was about returning with a feeling that there was more to the world than we can see. And I wanted to do that in a book I wrote, I wanted you to leave the book thinking there is more than I can see that I can look at the ordinary and see the extraordinary that I can emerge from a land of fairy tale and understand that just what I see isn't all that there is awesome. Um you know, actually, let me remind all of you out there. If you're watching, I do think we might have a couple minutes to ask patty live questions tonight. So, you have a question for patty. Um if you want to put it in, we would love to ask it. We'll hopefully get to a couple of those. Well wait, I want to ask one of the live ones right now because it's cracking me up. Yeah, he wants to know if anyone else is curious to know what that woman curled up in the background is breathing how these incredible authors there can be so unbalanced. But I didn't even, we didn't even know she was back there. We don't know who she is. She I but she's cooking dinner for us. So we were not here is my beloved sister in law serena and I don't think she knew that she was on camera. I but she's back there reading what kind of wardrobe. So I am dying laughing hilarious. She's like the best advertisement for your book. She's like so immersed in the story. She doesn't even know there's a show going on that's a problem. You know Patty, We had asked Alice a little bit about writing truth to herself when she's writing a book. And I was wondering were you learning anything or writing yourself a message as you were writing Once upon a wardrobe? Oh wow. Um I think that I was writing about how I was writing it during the pandemic. So during the pandemic, my graduate school son came home, my college son came home and my husband came home and I think I was really trying to find a way to see the extraordinary in what was this madly burning world around me. Um Are you sure you weren't just trying to escape? I was also trying to escape. He...

...was telling out I was I was I was tapped out and I would take my computer and I would go down to the river and I would you know walk into this world with George and Meg's and Lewis and his brother Warney and Oxford which I really wanted to go back to and couldn't. And so it was my way of returning to a land that I wanted to return to. Um But there is a fantastic essay by J. R. R. Tolkien called on fairy tales. And one of the things he writes is that they are the consolation of a happy ending. And I wanted to have that for us. I love that patty while you were doing all this noise. Which was there something surprising you learned while looking at the origins of Narnia? There were when I started doing the research about his life because I picked what I saw as the seven most influential moments in his life that show up in the Lion the Witch and the wardrobe. And when I was doing that research I didn't want to tell you what those were. I didn't want to have an appendix or list and say he did this and it meant that I wanted you to feel it and see it. Um You know story is the way we feel something, facts are not the way we feel anything. And so if I'm going to give you a list of facts are in appendix about how things panned out between his life and the story that's not going to move you or me. And so I decided that louis would tell these seven stories from his life. Meg would write them in a notebook and then meg would read them to her little brother and we would see those stories through her little brother's eyes. So we see these moments in Lewis's life through the innocence and naivety and this liminal kind of liminal space that this ill boy is living in between what's now and what's next. So when louis is in the attic writing and making up a magical land as a child with his brother in the corner of the little end room. He called it. We're with him when he is shipped off to a terrible boarding school. We are with him When his mother dies at nine years old we are with him and then we can decide how much of that we see in a story. I love them And there are no no there are no footnotes and there is not an appendix. No footnotes in fiction. No, no. But you know what's more magical than seeing story through the eyes of a child. I think that was exactly exactly the right way to tell it. What Yeah for me we have some live questions and somebody says uh which ordered is patty thank should somebody read the Chronicles of Narnia whatever order you want. I think it's a great question Marianne because I can tell you that there is a never ending argument among the chronicle specialists. Some people think you should start with the lion the witch and the wardrobe and others think you should start with a I think it's number four in the series. That is actually the prequel and some people number them one through seven differently. But I say read them in whatever order you want. Mm Good. Yeah I like that one. Okay, this is an amazing, amazing question. Robin Shelly wants to know what most impressed you about? Jack Lewis, The man through your research. Oh wow. That's a great question. What most impressed me? His resilience? I can say that his resilience. So we tend to put our most famous authors and our most favorite authors on a pedestal and we forget that they're human and that they've had broken moments in their life and that they have had, you know, darkness and light. We stay see this piece of work they did and we think their genius, that's who they are. This is everything. And we forget that they have all these moments in their life where they're broken or heartbroken. And for me his resilience in coming through losing his mother at a young age, being sent to boarding school, surviving World War One when his closest friend was killed right next to him. These are the things that he survived and not only did he survive...

...them, he took those moments and turned them into a magical land that we want to be in. He took all these ordinary moments in his life and turned them into something extraordinary. And for that I think is the thing I am most impressed about him. I know a lot of other people would answer differently and they would say his genius or his writings, but for me it is how he was able to Malcolm eyes and take these parts of his life and transform them for us? The great man? That's awesome. You know, Patty Laurie Alcon Brown is wondering, did you think about writing this book when you were writing becoming mrs Lewis? Nope? When I was, I won't leave it there. When I was right, when I was writing becoming mrs Lewis, I did see some of these breadcrumbs and some of these nuggets and you know, I noticed but I was onto another book. I was writing surviving Savannah. So these were not things that I was thinking I would ever turn into something else, but as our mary Kay andrews always says there are the ladies in the attic and they are up, they're sending down signals and ideas. And this showed up and this little eight year old boy named George showed up, not literally in my imagination and I knew that I wanted to tell a story about imagination and the kind of clanging of imagination vs. Logic and how do we explain the unexplainable. And so I didn't plan on it and I didn't mean to and I spent two years on a completely Different book, you know about Savannah in 1838. So this wasn't in the works, this was bubbling in the background. I have like kind of a couple questions for you. Like rapid fire back to back this one you have to answer? So surely Carhart wants to know, Are you ladies ever going to come to the Northeast Manasquan, New Jersey Book Town. Yes, yes, definitely. Forever. Yes, that's where megaliths and we were definitely planning on doing that definitely. Absolutely. Once Covid is gone, we are hitting the road and carry. Sudirman wants to notice Patti have a wardrobe in her home. Oh my gosh, that's a great. Great question. I don't. Um but no, we're all gonna have to chip in. I am. You know, somebody sent me this fantastic picture the other day Kerry and it was a wardrobe that somebody had opened the doors and added a bench in it and painted like a wintry scene in the background And it was a reading nook for a kid and I had like a little lantern light And I am going to I'm going to go junking with mary Kay andrews and I'm going to find a wardrobe and I'm going to turn it into a reading nook for a child. What about the wardrobe that I posted on instagram. I loved that wardrobe. Will you go get it for me? It's actually my linen closet. I was gonna put I have a full rental storage that has a really do have, you can have it, you can feed the inside and well that's great. And once you make it into a reading nook. Your sister in law can read in their next time. I mean, you know. All right wait. Alright, everyone, please stick around because we have some surprises Plus the giveaway of the paris market candle coming up on our after show. But first we wanted to remind all of you out there to check out our friends and fiction writer's block podcasts will always post the links under announcements each time a new one goes out, it's a lot of fun and it's totally different from this show. So if you like hanging out with us here, um we know you will love being there with us too. So it's every friday. And this past week Ron talked to Sari Feldman about library rock stars. And this week Ron we'll talk to Patty and to Christie about the inspiration behind their new novels and make sure to join the friends and fiction. I'm not in the screen official Book Club, which is number from us and run by our friends lisa Harrison and Brenda Gardner on monday october 25th they're going to be talking to paige Crutcher about her new novel, The orphan, which just out and I'll be joining them the day before that. On october 24th. Talk about christmas and Peachtree Bluff, which comes out in six days days. All of us also have an event together that day at Oxford exchange so we might have some surprise. Pop it. So I can't I can't get I don't know what their schedules are going to be but it's possible. So, you might want to stick around then. She we didn't ask.

She didn't ask us by doing it anyway. I didn't like it. I can't say they're coming and then not show up. Right? But don't forget you can get all three, everyone. Winter releases the santa suit patties once upon a wardrobe and my christmas and Peachtree blah from Oxford exchange. You can also add on christians Beautiful the forest diminishing stars as an option. And I have to remind you to subscribe to both our newsletter and our Youtube channel so that you have access to all of our past episodes and you never miss a thing. Like when facebook goes down. Yeah, I don't think that don't be a victim. That makes me seize up. Also, if you're driving distance of florida, come see us this weekend road trip, road trip with we're gonna have roadies. I think we must obviously okay on saturday, all four of us will be in my hometown. ST Pete Holla were that I was being trainee. I mean, uh 20 being age tank. Ageism is real. Talk to them. I I that's being aged. Oh sorry. We won't do it again. Ron, Ron is nick hashtag love talk. You guys are all drinking the champagne. Hashtag both talk Oh my goodness saturday. All of us will be in ST Pete at tom below books. On sunday will be in Tampa at the Oxford exchange on monday. We'll be doing events in punta Gorda and Sanibel. You can find the info on any of our websites under events and that is on the interwebs. For those of you. Your web. That's not real. Huh? All right, no, true. My gosh. Uh speaking of events next week, join us right here at seven eastern as we welcome. No, I am not even gonna tell you there were to be here next Wednesday because now I've been shamed. But richard paul Evans will help us to talk about my she's getting ignored. I said she started alright, my favorite. Okay, we'll celebrate Richard paul Evans book and the launch of Christie's christmas and extreme Bluff, which I did blurb. And if you, I mean I've learned your book, how can you shoot me? You're ever wondering about our schedule. It is all this is available on friends and fiction website and wait, stop scrolling. I can't see me. You can also see our fall schedule on our facebook banner on the Interweb way is rolling around. I thought I had it but clearly I'm not a responsible slave driver. Alright. To all of you out there. We encourage you to grab Alice's books for more weeks this week and of course Patties beautiful new book too. And I would also encourage you to order the santa suit and christmas impeachment you brought bluff which is coming out in just six days. Were so excited to celebrate that there is magic in the air. There's veuve in the tummies of my friends. I clearly clearly had a campaign. Exactly. Look, join us. Yeah, backgrounds. Clearly you're not going to want to miss this after show. So there is magic in the air and lucky you because all you have to do is order these clothes and you too can have magic in the palms of your hands in just a matter of days. So don't forget to stay for after show. We have are poppin meg and some other guests coming and come back next week. Same time, same place as we welcome Richard paul Evans to celebrate Christie's pete christmas in Peachtree please celebrating you celebrate as we, as we welcome Richard paul Evans to celebrate Christie's christmas and Peachtree Bluff. I am so grateful to all of you for tuning in and I'm so glad we got to talk to Alice and talk a bit about Once...

...upon a wardrobe and I hope you love it And that you feel the same way I did while I was writing it about the true magic behind one of the 20th century's there. So disrespectful. Most beloved fairy tales. I will see you in a minute at the after show. Oh my gosh, y'all that was moving And that was so much fun. That was so much fun when I am being told No, but how that was her. I said well and patty said, what was that? I was here for the holiday. I was all about it all about it. Oh my God you can say that on a O. L. Instant messenger I and that's you're shaming me for being a A. O. L. Still. I know you. That's true. I'm ending this Stop with the Holla. That was so much fun. And Alice Hoffman was amazing the way she can talk about magic and realism. And and in the past, she's just, I'm so impressed with her. And she didn't even flinch when we asked how she went back and forth. She writes historical fiction about real people. Then she writes magic. Then she writes screenplays and she's like, yeah, whatever. Like I can do all of You know, who else? Yes. You know who else is Megan bag bag. You know, who else is amazing, serena. All right, you take back control of my friends. Do you want to tell us who won your beautiful candle? Yes, meg picked randomly. I just have to say, Someone just said, this is funny. Champagne hitting. We haven't there are four of us. We barely dented a bottle of champagne together and we're like tickled. Like we're so happy to be together. That only being drinking, but only hollaback girls. That hollaback hollaback girl. Okay, the winner is carry Suderman. And she has said, Kerry. Sudirman, congratulations. She said my favorite fairy tale as a child was Sleeping Beauty because I love Flora fauna and Merryweather. Gosh. I forgot their names. That's beautiful. The three Fairy Godmothers. I pretended they were my godmother's to carry. Well um direct messages and I will get that candle in the mail to you. It smells glorious. Is made of pine and sugar, plum and amber. It smells like marijuana and Merryweather, flora, fauna and Merryweather. It smells like an elder tears, elves, tears and they sell them in paris market if you all want some. But it looks like you had a great event there last night. Yeah, it was a product. It was just absolutely over the top. Like you should have seen how it's decorated and it was the best celebration of her you can imagine. And don't forget we have champagne. Too shocking. So shocking, shockingly. We have champagne. So don't we have already for more weeks tonight you will get one of the wooden bookmarks which are also quite magical. Who's supposed to talk now? Christie Woodson? I am. But I thought christian was trying to say something. Oh no, no, God, God, I was just telling you about the champagne I was bringing for saturday, but that's okay. I guess we would like we would like to hear about that high hollow about that. All I have thought about this week is like what bottles of wine and what food I'm bringing? Like it's like taking over my entire head. I don't think that is yes, why we love you. That is why we love it. We're gonna need something more than you know, a protein bar. And I have a baggie in my car of them and I'm sick of all the flavors already and it's only day three, no protein just got it. Okay discussed, we've announced a candle winter and um, I wanted to remind you about our road trip, which we've already talked about a little bit. So it's mary cain mentioned, the four of us will be together in florida this weekend. It's a part of our book tours. We're hitting the road to celebrate the santa suit Holla holla baby Hattie's road, which is out now in stores wherever books are sold and my christmas and Peachtree blast which comes out next Tuesday and Kristen is joining us as a moderator and obviously we'll have her books available also will be in Saint Pete Tampa punta Gorda and saying about, you can find the information on each of our individual websites as well as the friends of fiction newsletter and website. Oh and um Sean is telling us that people are asking what is the paris market? The...

...paris market is this unbelievably magical And we are over using the word but not compared to the store store in downtown savannah and they have a website, it's called Bruton street and it is called the paris market and you can find their website and they have just the most amazing things. Okay, so you'll have the chance to see all of us in florida and just a few days and I can't wait. But right now we have another amazing opportunity to celebrate magic and friendship and that's because our special guests tonight to pop in right now are meg walker and lisa Harrison and Brenda Gartner. Our dear friends who run the fan friends fiction club as well as our beloved rockstar, librarian Ron block who helms are extraordinary podcast and I need to keep out right guys, cheers to you daddy lunch holiday, you mary Kay, holla holla holla, I say holla all the time. It's like my favorite word. So you are so don't. Yeah, good. Oh my God is the only rooster in the Henhouse. He's easy to spot. Oh y'all are amazing. Oh yeah, while celebrating friendship, Sean, can you pop onto Sean? We want you to join us. The whole gang is here, this is the entire team, y'all. This is the magic happening in these little squares. Okay, we love you all so much and our viewers don't often get to see you. Have they ever seen Sean? Yes, I do. Okay. Facebook friend request that week. That was a good week for me. Thank you. Okay, like where they've been hatin! Did you write a song for me for once. A kind of work that way. Oh no, no, that's okay. You just let us know when you're ready. Okay. You know how well, all of us, we all have such lovely voices. So we all have stories that stick in our consciousness, our stories that just stick with us in general and rise up when things are tough for whatever is going on. And of course mine is the lion, the witch and the wardrobe. But what is one that y'all love? I'd love to hear if there's a story that worked some magic in your life. So, I'm going to start with you Ron. Well, it's a good follow up to Alison that she kind of brought out that some of the darker stories can be so special. And for me, it was early when I was really young. I heard the little Match Girl. I love that one. Right, Right. And when my kids were born, as they, you know, reading stories of them at the holidays, I would read it to them and I would be crying and they'd be looking at me like I'm a crazy person. But it was a great story to teach about like looking at um the joys in life and um and build empathy in yourself for others and not take things at face value. So, for me, it's just always stayed with me and now they read it to their Children. So Ron I've always loved that story. But the message I got, it's so great how when you read a fairy tale, everybody gets something different. The match girl for me was about not wasting your fire. Like not wasting your creative energy. That was deep. That's what I got out of it. All right, my friend lisa, what was yours? Tell me a story that worked some magic in your life for me. I loved cancel and Gretel because when I was younger I thought it was cool that the kids, you know the moral is you know obey your parents, don't talk to strangers. That could be weird, creepy witches. And for me I loved that the kids outsmarted the witch and I was like yeah you can listen to your parents but you could still be smarter than your parents for me as a kid. That was like eye opening. And then I think that opened up things for me because I started to like witches and looking into like magical things. So I loved Hansel and Gretel growing up. That's my favorite. I just I love hearing somebody else's view of a tail. We think we all know. All right, Our friend Brenda, I want to hear your favorite story that works some magic in...

...your life. Well, I'm going a little bit older from the really young fairy tales and this is not so much a fairy tale, but the secret garden just meant so much to me and I don't know if it was the shriveled up old garden that was hidden and and nobody knew about that came to life or if it was about Colin who was this, you know the sickly child who you know blossom like the garden once he started working and and it's funny because I just thought about it just now. The the empathy I felt for Colin is a lot like George and once upon a wardrobe. So um it just was a powerful story to me about friendship and about transformation and that just stuck with me. There are definitely, I I feel like there's some good parallels there to Really. Yeah. But yeah, I really do. I got those like sort of vibe like in the best way, like you get that feeling that you felt. Yeah, that's a huge compliment. All right. How about um Kay, Well you know I'm a child of 50s and 60s. So my representation of so many classic fairy tales where the Disney versions which were cleaned up and fantasized and uh technicolor. Um but another Disney movie um version which was the Swiss Swiss Family Robinson. So my first book, that was my very own, I was the second of five kids. Five kids born in seven years. Everybody shared everything. But my first book that I owned was given to me as a christmas gift. And it was one of those big large format little golden books and it was a swiss family Robinson and I think that probably started my love of making a home and making the best of a bad situation and then of course I saw the movie at the drive in theater in ST Pete I think kurt russell was dad. No, no, he was a kid honey. I'm old that we know that. Yeah. Yes, exactly. No, I love, I love the idea of they salvaged all the stuff from the shipwreck and they made this happy home. And of course it's not at all. In the original um Swiss Family Robinson, which is a very deep in real life swiss family Robinson was written by a swiss pastor who wanted to more allies, but in the Disney movie, you know, they're out riding an ostrich on a south seas desert island, which is a little unlikely, but nothing about that. I, you know from that the time I watched that movie and read my little golden book, I was always like making houses and making forts and trying to figure out how to capture an ostrich imported to ride. What would help you next week to help people, you know, Ep, we'll look for some options. That would be awesome. Just sad. All right. How about you kristen? But it's a story that has worked magic in your life. You know, I was thinking about this and I was not a big fairytale reader when I was a kid. I watched the Disney movies. You know, I mean, I grew up in florida, I grew up all things Disney. Um but you know what? I went really resonated with me as a kid. I was obsessed when I was a young teenager with john f Kennedy. And what is the story of john f Kennedy. If not, it will be a life campaign. Right? I mean, Camelot is such a fairy tale, including the Darkness that we talked about. Right? I mean it's the it's that sense of kings and queens and royalty, right? It's the dark, it's the light, it's the triumph. It's the tragedy. It's just all of these things that sort of teach us something and make us feel something. And the more I thought about that, the more I was thinking, you know, fairy tales reflect life and life can reflect fairy tales. And I think we see that, I think we see that in Once Upon a wardrobe, you're telling the story behind the story. But the actual telling of that story is this beautiful magical fairy tales. So they're trying to discover the magic, but the magic is there, the magic is in them. And I think, I don't know that just occurred to me as I was thinking about Kennedy earlier at the Kennedy Kennedy's you bring in a full circle, wow, that gave me kind of chill bumps. All right, Christine. How about you? So this was not what I was going to say.

But as I was sitting here, I remember as a child loving puss in Boots and I don't know why, like, I don't remember the story, I remember anything, so I can't wait to go read it because it was my favorite child. So now I want to go back and read it. But this is not like a fairy tale per se, but I've probably said this on the show before, but I loved Matilda and uh like he is able to channel her goodness and turn it into true magic to fight people who were evil and going back to once upon a wardrobe. I mean when we think about you know George and how he sort of finding his own personal Narnia or at least to me, he was like, that struck me from the beginning um Matilda is finding her Narnia like in the end, you know, it really is a good comparison, but there's nothing told him with these huge imaginations that channel their imagination to create the world that they want for themselves. Stories affected so much a all right, well I like Kristen, I think I wasn't a big fairytale kid and I did, I was not a real girly girl, I didn't like the princess stories that speak to me, but I was and I don't think this is really what people think of as a fairy tale, but um as a huge christmas night I was born on christmas day, so she's our christmas elf with reindeer. Gosh, I love it because to me the ultimate anti bullying story and yeah, amongst the everybody has something to contribute and if we all just recognize a little bit of goodness into each other, like um we're going to get the sleigh moving and we're gonna get the job done? Oh yeah. Oh my gosh, so we got that. Love it. Alright sean we're gonna make you talk instead of singing, Wait to hear shine. I know, you know, I was just thinking about everyone that you guys mentioned, you know, I'm a father of two young kids so I get to relive you know, childhood and all. I'm trying to check all the boxes and even like Wizard of Oz, we haven't done you know, but we're doing the Disney ones, we've done that, but I just don't know what categorizes anymore as fairy tales and you know, I think about all the movies that really impacted me. I'm sorry. I know it should be booked, but I think about 18 Spielberg fairy tale. Yeah, that's a great one. Oh my gosh. I mean because like I say about the lion, the witch and the wardrobe, even if you've never read it, you know who as one is, you know who the white witches, even if you've never seen E. T. You know, I love that. Oh do that again. All right. We're going to ask the girl on the couch what was your favorite I Yeah, she's in now. Mhm. We made her frees up. She's the biggest reader I've ever met in my life. She's our best reader. All right. Yeah, sorry about that, Ron do you want to take a turn and ask patty a question. Well I do. But you have another sip of who first. Alright. Whatever. Uh boom talk talk. Okay, so I've kind of asked you this podcast is not going to talk with, you know, that could be a special holiday edition holidays. Okay, it's over. Sure. I have my shirt. I'm gonna send it today. Holiday holidays. I love it. I have to sample everything. Okay. Okay, so I've asked you this a little bit before, but one of the things that you really haven't talked about tonight is whether it's the stories that Meg is telling, Meg's telling George or the stories that um that Lewis was telling the megs, you have sprinkled magic over every part of this book and part of that comes down into the setting. Whether it's Meg sitting on the rock and or the snow falling or the travels that they make, it's an element in everything. And how do you make that work? Oh, that is such a lovely compliment and I, I sort of mentioned this before that I was writing it during the lockdown and I wanted to live in that world, a world where Meg's would sit in a snowy forest and a stump covered in snow would look...

...like an elf or she would be able to see the medieval castle that inspired care parable and that she would have to have an adventure to do things like that. So I was taking myself on the adventures that I wanted them to go on and I wanted it to feel like there was some magic. I wanted them to feel like they were taking the parts of his life and they were seeing it through new eyes. So thanks. Oh no, that's so true. So true. And so magical and congrats on the book. Thanks. Okay. We've gone way over our time limit and we have had a hollaback time. I am. I will never ever live this down. I can't say as long as we're moving away from patty and the sound effects were in good shape. I know you did. So I should have been some way my gosh, y'all are amazing. Thank you so much for joining us for Alice Hoffman and for a launch of Once upon a wardrobe and for magic and for books And don't forget to as mary care says, buy our books, dammit! You put on my screw pants. Yes, I would like that. And we'll put on some Olivia newton, john I good night everyone everybody. Good night. Thank you for tuning in. You can join us every week on facebook or Youtube where our live show airs on Wednesday nights at seven p.m. Eastern time. Also subscribe to our podcast and follow us on instagram. We're so glad you're here.

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