Friends & Fiction
Friends & Fiction

Episode · 2 months ago

Friends & Fiction Celebrates Debut Authors with Lou Diamond Phillips, Gervais Hagerty, Addison Armstrong, and Paige Crutcher

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

This episode is all about debut authors! F&F welcomes to the show four first-time novelists—all with new or recent books out—to learn all about their journey to publication. Meet acclaimed actor Lou Diamond Phillips (Young Guns, La Bamba, Prodigal Son) as we hear all about his debut YA science fiction fantasy novel The Tinderbox (released 8/3/21 by Blackstone), inspired by Hans Christian Andersen's famous fairy tale of the same name. We also welcome Gervais Hagerty (In Polite Company, out 8/17/21 from William Morrow), Addison Armstrong (The Light of Luna Park, released 8/10/21 by Penguin), and Paige Crutcher (The Orphan Witch, coming 9/28/21 from St. Martin's Press).
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001617/ https://gervaishagerty.com/ https://addisonarmstrong.com/ https://paigecrutcher.com/ 

Welcome to Friends and Fiction. Fivebest selling authors and the stories novelist mary Kay Andrews, ChristineHarmel, Christie Woodson harvey patty Callahan, Henry and mary Alice Munroare five longtime friends with more than 80 published books to their creditIn 2020 they created friends and fiction to provide author interviewsand fascinating insider. Talk about publishing and writing and to highlightindependent bookstores. These friends discuss the books, they've written thebooks they're reading now and the art of storytelling. If you love books andyou're curious about the writing world, you're in the right place. Yeah. Hello,hello everybody. It's a Wednesday night and that means it's time for Friendsand fiction. Welcome to our show. We have so much to look forward to tonight.I'm Christine Harmel, I'm Christie Woodson harvey, I am patty Callahan andI'm mary Kay Andrews and this is Friends and fiction, five or tonightfour new york times, bestselling authors, endless stories all in supportof indie bookstores and readers like you. Tonight will be celebrating debutnovels with the help of some special guests including first time authorsAddison, Armstrong jerry Haggerty and paige Crutcher and you guys, how coolis this movie star, broadway star, television star and director loudiamond phillips whose debut novel just came out in paperback on august 3rd.We'll talk to all four of them about the hopes fears and challenges thatcome along with the debut, how they broke in and what advice they have forothers at the beginning of an exciting and challenging journey and we'll beasking at least one of them about a little upcoming film you might know asyoung guns three if there's anything he can tell us. And in our continuingsupport of indie bookstores tonight, our bookstore of the week is one of ourfavorite stores copper fish books and punta gorda florida. We'll be tellingyou a little bit more about that in a minute and we also want to remind youthat all month long we are taking a bike out of summer with our friends andCarolina. Thanks. Each of us has been posting about our favorite summariesand Labor Day plans on our individual facebook and instagram pages. And witheach of these, those posts were offering you guys the chance to win theultimate labor Day weekend beach bag brimming with swag from friends infiction and Caroline's including 10 novels, 10, 10 novel cake bites in theflavor of your toys. And you know that every week we partner with Parademagazine online for friends and fiction essay series this week, Patty rightabout traveling three books. You can find it linked on our facebook page andin our instagram bio. But meanwhile patty, can you tell us a little bitabout your fabulous essay. You know, when we were stuck at homeduring covid and we all started reading more probably I think the readingindustry if that's what you want to call it sky rocketed. But there havebeen other times in my life when I haven't been able to travel or getabout or get out in the world, you know, breast cancer treatment for example, orhaving young babies or in college and working night shift as a nurse. Andbooks were always away to get somewhere else to be somewhere else and not asmuch as escape, but as a means for greater and bigger life. And so I wroteabout that and I want to hear some of your books that have taken you toplaces you weren't able to go. Well. I mean just recently, taylor Jenkinsreads Malibu rising took me to Malibu. Yeah. And I would say that Stephenrally took me to Palm Springs with the Gunkel someone fun and you know,Stephanie dres the women of chateau Lafayette I think was a big travel bookfor me this year and she took us to France in three different time periods,which was really cool. That I think is kind of the perfect segue because allfour of our special guests have written novels that transport us. So let's dive.Right in First up tonight is Lou Diamond Phillips and author, you allknow because since the mid 1980s, he has been absolutely everywhere. You mayknow him from a little film called La Bamba for instance, where he playedRitchie Valens. I'm think I'm gonna have to rewatch that movie. I think weshould have. I think we should have a group of friends and fiction of bombawatch party because or you might know...

...him from a little movie called Standand Deliver for which he was nominated for a Golden Globe and one anindependent spirit award. Or if that's not enough you might have heard of alittle pair of movies called Young Guns and Young Guns two in which lu costarred with my favorite from the eighties, Emilio estevez and keep YourSutherland's which every time I hear his name I think of 24 he talks in thatwhisper the whole time in 24 essentially cementing lose complete andtotal box office domination of the late eighties and early nineties. But didlou diamond phillips stop their content to be merely a legit heartthrob. Hedoubled down. I did ask him. Okay great thanks. Well as the head of a singer ofa band called the pipe fitters who once plays a massive farm made benefitconcert founded by Willie nelson, john Mellencamp and Neil Young or how abouta Tony nominated turn as the King in the 1996 Tony Tony award winningrevival of Rodgers and Hammerstein's the King and on broadway, honest to GodI think I saw him in that. Hello. I'm sure that was lou more recently. Youmight have seen him Basically any time you turned on your television. He starton everything from 24 to his guest starred on everything from 24 tonumbers Brooklyn 99 Blue Blue Bloods Law and Order S. V. U. And over 100more shows he's had starring roles and shows including Long Longmire. Well Ican't talk. I'm proud of this song. What God is God his voice the maincharacters in the Children's shows. Elena of Avelar and the Lion Guardbasically if you have a television Lee Diamond Phillips has been in your housefor at least the last 20 years and what am I doing with my life right now? Iget it together. But wait there's more. He also won the food network realityseries Rachel versus Guy Celebrity Cook off. He was featured in imagine Dragonsmusic video for radioactive. Remember that music video guys He once taughtsnuffle up against how to write his name on Sesame street. He's appeared onthe World series of Poker. And I guess because his schedule isn't full enough.He's also written screenplays and directed episodes of shows includingProdigal Son, Agents of Shield Longmire and the Twilight Zone and the entireisn't that amazing? We could spend the entire night talking to him about hisamazing screen career. But of course we're here to discuss anotherincredible endeavor. His debut novel the Tinderbox soldier of Indira. Andyou'll have to tell me if I'm saying that right Erica can you bring loudiamond phillips on please. Okay. Oh good you wonderful. You know thoseinteresting and that's why I don't look at my imdb page. You know they just putme to sleep, it's like, oh my God, I'm so tired, I've done so much. Okay,we're we feel like uh when did you sleep? Never mind. When did you writeyour novel? Exactly, Well, it's such a pleasure to have you on tonight. And Ihave to say a big thank you to our mutual friend, comedian and journalist,Michelle, whoa ho how do you say her last name? Wo wo wo kowski huh?Something, yeah, she's amazing, Wojo and you could yeah, she's fantastic. Soshe's the one who put us in touch and I'm so glad she did. So we're so gladto have you here, can you start a little by telling us tonight a littlebit about the Tinderbox, which just came out in paperback on August 3rd.Thank you. Well, I mean most people are very, very happy to hear that theinspiration for the entire novel came from my wife, my wife Yvonne, um andwhen we first started dating uh we literally just passed our 14 yearanniversary uh married, we've been together I think uh like 18 years,something like that. Crazy. But when we first started dating shoes and makeupartist, but she was also an amazing graphic artist. Um she knew about myacting, but she's not really any of my writing and you know, I've gotscreenplays, got screenplays that haven't been produced, I have a novelthat I wrote in college that I need to go back to because it never got, youknow published. Um and I looked at some drawings that she had done that hadbeen inspired by hans christian Andersen's short story Tinderbox, Butshe had done them and this is in the 90s, so she was cool and hip and and anerd before, it was cool and hip. So so she had done these in in the mangastyle, you know, back when you could have had to actually go down to youknow the bookstore and get the mangga, order it from Japan as opposed toclicking it up on your phone. So she had done these amazing drawings thatshe was thinking about turning into a um graphic novel and they were just soevocative uh they felt like a feudal,...

...you know, sword and sorcery, uh youknow princesses and kings and knights and that sort of thing, but with thisjapanese sort of influence and to me it was like, boom, okay, that Star Warsbecause Star Wars took so much, you know, from Kurosawa and I said this isa movie. So she's a great, wonderful. And I said about and I wrote ascreenplay when I finished the screenplay, we looked at each other andthis is too damn expensive and nobody's going to give us this money. I've neverdirected anything this expensive. So we talked about it and uh talked aboutwith my manager, JB roberts has always been so supportive and he said writethe book, just write the book, you know, uh you know, easier said than done myday job, kept getting in the way. Uh and so it took 10 years, took 10 yearsoften on, you know, writing some going away from it, coming back to it. And wewere talking about Craig johnson earlier, he was instrumental in mefinishing the novel a lot of hearing that I was Longmire, and after, I thinkin the second season I finally got enough bravery to go craig, you know, Iwrite a little, you know, and I said, would you look at this and I think Igave him a chapter and a half or something like that. I said, am Iwasting my time and my out of my mind here, and he read it and he loved it.And uh and he says, you have to finish this, you have to finish this. So Istarted going back to it in earnest after having dabbled for a little whileand like I said, the process to not only finished the novel, but Go to theedits the polishing everything else. And actually the published was inexcess of 10 years, wow, can you tell us a little bit about the plot of thenovel? What can we expect from picking it up? It's, you know, I mean, ifanybody's read the short story, it is the short story, the plot doesn'tappear from it all that much, but I've extrapolated it into a galaxy far, faraway. Uh And it allowed me to I think give it more that allegorical flavor,you know, that more fairy tale favor less sort of thing when when you know,it's in another world, it allows you to go somewhere else. And so uh what'sfunny is that is that a lot of my influences are very evident and they'refrom Lewis carroll uh you know, gaming machine there. Uh you know, uhdefinitely the hans christian Andersen and writers of that period. And so thelanguage is a little heightened um and our novel has dogs, it has a witch, butit is not a witch W I Tch it's a witch W. H. I C H. because there are fourtellers which the where the wind, the wind and it's got a little bit of that,you know. Uh the language in the wardrobe, I mean, it wants to feel likea novel from that period, but with I I think very relevant um uh themes andideas Race certainly plays a part in my hero is brown. Uh It's a planet thatsplit into two. Uh And all the brown people went to one side and all thewhite folks went to the other, but the white folks are in the desert now,which is very odd. But uh you know, it's it's about it's about a young manand a hero's journey and a princess who has been uh uh you know, locked away byher father, the king lo these many years because of a prophecy that hiskingdom will end, should she ever marry a common soldier? So, you know, it's uhit has very, very much fairytale aspirations, even though it's Sciencefive, and that's so funny when I finished, I think this is why, and Iwas like, okay, but it's also a sci fi novel. Okay, it was a very tell fantasy.Yeah, I told the story, I mean, whatever category you guys want to putit into, it's up to you. Yeah, wow, blowing me away. You have worked in thearchetypes and the stories and the wider mythology of so many differentthings and even sprung to mind when you were talking, like fantasies by GeorgeMacdonald and which also inspired the witch and the wardrobe, which alsoinspired Tolkien, which it's just you're you're working in this hugerealm of mythology and legends, because I mean, once again, like you said, Imean, there's a lot of Romeo and Juliet in there. There's a lot of Shakespeareand Shakespearean references, There are easter eggs throughout the thing,there's even a little reference to a Beatles song, but, you know, uh the theinfluences come from the literary world and they come from the cinematic worldas well. I mean, the reason I I originally decided to write it as a scifi was that, you know, it was going to be a movie and at the time game ofThrones hadn't happened. So the fans wasn't his hip, but alcohol was amassive hit. Star Wars was still going strong. So I thought to make it acommercial, you know, film, I'll make it a sci fi. I never set out to write asci fi. Any lawn when when we we would turn it back into a novel was so pissedat me because the administration, but I...

...don't do sci fi, I don't drawspaceships, I don't draw weird creatures, just draw what you'reinspired by, you know. Uh and so she uh she really, I think found thisbeautiful hybrid of of the kind of german woodcut stuff that she reallydoes. Well uh that was prevalent in the Lewis carroll, but also in the originalhans christian Andersen and she brought into that and almost barbarella sci fi,steampunk sensibility and the graphic novel sensibility. So the illustrations,I think it was this market that they are, they are, they're great, they'regreat. So you have had and you continue to have an incredible career on cameraand on stage and is one of the most prolific and recognizable actors of thelast 3.5 decades. So don't think you did and I don't want to hear somehumble No, no, no, it writes me that acting is first and foremost and alwaysabout character about taking on a role wearing it like a second skin becomingthat character in so many ways. And you're a great example of that becauseyou're not an actor who's typecast, you've played all kinds of differentkinds of characters and while watching you in a role, we definitely know whoyou are, but we forget because you embody those characters. So here's whatI'm curious about. Can you talk a bit about what your processes as an actorfree creating such realistic and deeply felt characters and how much of thatinfluence the way you wrote the Tinderbox? Uh 100% influences the waythat characters came out in Tinderbox. And I'd like to say one thing is I'mproud of is I think that every one of the characters resonates uh from fromthe smallest character as you know, one appearance to you know, the hero or youknow, the princess Princess Allegra, which by the way, the Allegra Cafe inVancouver was the first place that we uh uh you want and I had a date andthat and that's what I'm sweet. Um so I mean when I taught acting on occasionand and you're right, I mean whether it's theater, film, television, I'veplayed good guys, I played bad guys, I played really bad guys, uh you know, uhsupporting, leading comedic, uh you know, dramatic and and the same thingalways applies and that is you have to subjugate as a human being, your ego tothe character. Uh you cannot hold them at arm's length, even when I'm playingsomebody like Richard Ramirez in the film I did called the Night stalkerwith the wonderful bellamy Young who was with me and Prodigal son. Uh youhave to adopt that characters worldview, you cannot judge them if you're goingto play them uh and and judge them. The audience will see you apologize and youcan't do that to think that you have to open your mind and your heart and youdon't have to agree with them, but you have to fully invest yourself in thatcharacter and and the parts of yourself that you know, that would apply to thatcharacter and somebody said, well I could never do that. I could, I couldnever be a serial. And it's like, well, you know, you ever thought I could killthat guy, you just take that and extrapolate it. You know, you take theword no out of your head and you uh once again, don't, don't apologize forhow the character lives their life, you live that life on this and uh doeverything you can to to present it fully and completely uh and a lot ofthat, you know, I lost a lot of weight for uh Richard Ramirez in that film, Ilost a lot of weight for the 33 where I played uh Don lucio Chilean Miner whogot caught him, he was the foreman of the Chilean miners who was caught inthat cave in back in 2010 in chile. And so you do your research. You know you alot a lot of the you know writers who are friends of mine always do theirresearch about the books. And it's the same in the acting world. You know ifyou if you need to learn how to you know make an omelet even learn how tomake an omelet if you're gonna put on camera so that people believe that youknow how to do this. So yeah, I mean playing a cop tons of research in thatarea, playing a soldier, you know uh playing Richard Ramirez. That was thatwas a deep type playing richie valence. It was watching all of the video thatwas that was possible eating every article it was talking at length withhis family. Uh you know I'm not in trouble from East L. A. But you know Idrove around for two weeks with the brother who was uh you know who grew upin that life, you know and we went to the places where terrible thingshappened to him, He did terrible things and you know it was my it was my job toabsorb that. It's fascinating you know lou I've seen that you're so active ontwitter which I think is a gift to your fans because you are so authentic andwhen you interact with them and with us.

So all of you out there we posted alink to lose twitter account under announcements on facebook. You can findhim at at Loop capital D phillips. Reading through some of your pasttweets. I'm curious about a few of the things you said, oh no, I know, I don'tknow about you, but on twitter is where I get a little bit more open open. Yeah.So just the other day, you answered a question about how long it took you towrite this book and you said 10 years because you you know, you had a day job.Can you tell us a little bit about how that process worked where you and you,you answered a little bit of this already. So you went back and forth.Right? I did. And after a while I realized I did a play that I wrotecalled Burning Desire Comedy because they very rarely Caspian comedies. Uhwe produced at the Seven Angels theater at uh in Connecticut in Waterbury justa couple of years ago, I wrote that while I was doing the King and I onbroadway, I literally known it. I I r r going into work from Long Island. Iwrote it. I wrote during the act break uh on the, on the and I finally Idiscovered that I can write while I'm doing something else and in some waywhen I'm working, it just gets those creative juices flowing. So I I did theentire, I don't know, eight months of edits or whatever while I was shootingProdigal son, I kept, you know, a yellow pad with me and by the way,don't screenshot that, that yeah. Uh, yeah, I keep I keep a yellow pad withme at all times and you know, I mean if the senate will come to me or aparagraph or whatever, you know, while I'm on set is right through my chair, Ijot it down, keep the computer in the dressing room, you know? And and so Idiscovered that that I could work while I was working a good chunk of it waswritten during Longmire. Uh, and even, I think bigger chunk because I had moretime was done when I was doing the King and I in Australia. And Gilbert Labanwent with me because, you know, I could ride all day and then, you know, go tothe theater at six at night. So uh like I said, one hand washes the other andwhat when we're talking about my acting and my writing or directing any of that,I think there are branches of the same creative tree and and uh oneembellishes the other one uh, totally, you know, I think elevates the otherbecause because I'm looking at it, you know, from as a director, I'm lookingat it, you know, as an actor working on each one of those characters and then,you know, working on it as a writer who wants to create a world. Yeah, that'samazing. Yeah, and you might have already sort of touched a little bit onwhat I'm getting ready to ask you, but we'll ask you to sort of expand on it alittle bit um since we're talking about debut novels tonight, and since you arethe perfect example of someone who wanted to write a book and stuck withit over the course of a decade, even though life kept getting in the way,what advice can you give to writers out there who are toiling away on an ideaor who think they can't fit their dream into an already busy life? You know,it's uh first of all, it took me 10 years. I mean, a lot of people said, Oh,you got me through the book. Oh, yeah, yeah, he just spit it out and somebodysaid, well done to Phillips, you know, we'll just publish it. No, I I gotrejected a lot, wow. This book had a couple of dozen uh rejection letters.And in the movie ambition by the way that I wrote, my character is a writerand he's burning rejection letters by the way those were the real rejectionletters for the uh novel I wrote in college that I needed, wow, amazing.But again, it's never quit. If you believe in yourself, make it happen.And a line that I wrote, you know, in in my play, Um because the characters,a writer, but he's a waiter at the time and uh the leading ladies is what areyou waiting for? You know, she goes a writer, writes an actor, actor, dancerdances, they're all acts of verbs, so do it. You know, I've got, I've gotstuff in drawers that never got published or never got produced from 10years ago. I just them off every once in a while summer, trendy others Ithink, you know, uh, go beyond uh, window of time and then they're sorelevant and so have life to them. So it's about never giving up. But it'salso about doing a work, I think that we have a, and I used to call it anamerican idol, uh, mentality, but it's a lottery mentality. People want thingsinstantly. They, you know, they think they can do something, you know, justso brazen on Youtube that they'll instantly become famous and rich. Butwhen, when you're dealing with the arts, if you want to be an actor, if you wantto be a writer, you want to be a dancer. I mean, it's it's blood sweat and tears.It's you know, you, you apply your, your soul to this is going to be anygood at it. And if you want to have a...

...life at it and that's what it is. It'snot about instant fame or even rich is it that you love this and you have todo it? And for me finishing the novel, I just wanted to hold it in my hands,you know, the fact that it's been so well received and you know, theYvonne's drawing and has has gone through the roof as well. I mean that'sthat's such a plus, but we just wanted to hold them in our hands, we don't, wedid this, it's a great feeling, you all know, and you know it multiple times,you know, Craig johnson, I don't know how many Longmire books now. Anotherdear friend, Chris Bohjalian has, you know, had a that was my, by the way,rave book of this year. Uh so good. You know, I mean these guys do it everyyear on my way. Speaking of Chris, Bohjalian way to play for us. Hi ChrisBohjalian here, I want to say a little patty to all of you watching. And ofcourse, hi lou Diamond phillips High von, I want to say congratulations onthe Tinderbox being a finalist for the dragon or as many of you know, I lovedthat book, my lovely bride victoria loved that book are amazing Graceexperience, love that book. If you're Washington. Haven't read it, read it ifyou bring it, vote for it for a dramatic word and all of you have agreat time, man, I read everything he writes uh mentioned Craig and Craig isthe reason I finished the Tinderbox, Chris is the reason I got published. Uhwe're working on, on a couple of different things. He and I uh thatinvolved, you know, one of his other novels uh and and we've become goodfriends, I met him on twitter, well you know, you want who recommendseverything that I read, she gave me the flight attendant, she wants you gottaread this, this guy's amazing Brown or something. So I read the flight, youknow, oh my God, I got you know, page turner, right? And I said what if he'son twitter? But here he is. I followed him. He followed me. We have a yourmutual friend and john Fusco who wrote Younguns one and two. Uh they're both,you know, Connecticut Vermont type guys and uh we we do, we just hit it off andhave this friendship and once again, you know, we were talking about youknow this that and the other And I gave him, you know, the Tinderbox to readand he loved it and and he pointed me in the right direction. What's funny isthat his literary agent who is now my literary agent is the same woman to tryto sell my novel 20 years ago and am I right then? And she goes, I think wecan sell this one. I oh we love chris so much and we love his books and hecame on the show and talked about our of The Witch and he's an astoundingperson and astounding writers. So everyone out there, we totallyencourage you to vote for lou's book in the Dragon Awards, which chris justmentioned. And the Dragon Awards are linked to Dragon Con, which is a hugepop culture event held every Labor Day weekend in Atlanta. Right? And theyhonor excellence in sci fi and fantasy. They're entirely fan driven. So if youpick up loose the Tinderbox, we would love for you to vote for it. There is alink under announcements as usual on our facebook page. Absolutely, yeah,we're so excited about that. Um so lulu before you go, we wanted to ask youabout what you're working on next in a few areas, what are you working on nextin terms of books, and where can we see you on screen coming up soon? Oh mygoodness! So I let the cat out of the bag, I'm working on the sequel. Uh thereviews were so wonderful, and the one thing that Yvonne and I latched ontowas the fact that a lot of people fell in love with this world, the world thathave been created and a lot of these characters. Uh so it was like, okay,well let's let's do a sequel. Um We had thought I had thought for a long timethat we would go back into the end of the fairy tale world and I would uh youknow, I would extrapolate something else. Even came up with this plot. Shecame up with this story. Uh and it is so out of left field, but so therebetween the lines in the first book, but I was astounded. Uh, Whereas the1st 1 was a fairy tale and, and a bit of a hero's journey and an adventure.This one is a little bit of a mystery. So it's got, it's got that and and it'sgot a little bit of an environmental uh...

...side to it uh, doing that. And I justrecently um uh, did a nice cameo playing myself in a movie called EasterSunday with the comedian jo koy who had been comes with a number of years. Hegot his first feature film through Amblin Entertainment. It's semiautobiographical and he wrote the role for me to play me. So I feel like I'mnot that character down. I can't really say no to that either. It's really nota lot of people that can do as well as you know, you want to play with me. Ilove it. Okay, we have to ask, you are the rumors, can you tell us anythingabout Young Guns Three about whether that might be coming? Uh, it might becoming. Uh yeah, more, no, Amelia reached out to me about a year ago andhe had written a script. Uh, I have mentioned our friend john Fusco johnEmilio wrote the script, I think john has done a polish on it. I don't knowwhere they are as far as getting it together for production, but uh, it'sin the works and, and it is, uh, it is a real thing, It is a real rumor,Amelia is committed to it. Uh, and when he calls me, that's it man regulatorsmount up back in the saddle, regulators. It is awesome. Alright, well, assumingthat it does go forward, I can't imagine that it wouldn't, how do youfeel about returning to a role from the past and especially a role that remainsSo iconic and to working with these actors who you really kind of grew upwith 30 years ago. Well, first not everybody will be in and I'm going to,you know, that's a little bit of a teaser uh, or a few of us that willreturn. Um, and I have to say from what I read in the initial draft, uh, he dida brilliant job of bringing it forward and, and aging these characters towhere we would be now, you know, older but wiser guns. Uh, you know, slowerbut crotchety guns, I don't know. Uh, and um, there are truths and there arelessons for, I think there are things in the characters that I don't knowwere available to us when we were in our 20s. Uh, and I think that's, that'skind of wonderful, you know, I mean, when you think of when you think aboutan old gun slinger who, you know, probably should have been in the grounda long time ago, that comes with a lot of gravitas, that comes with a lot ofexperience and a lot of pain and I and uh that's one of the things that Ithink is really, really compelling. Uh not only about the script in general,but certainly, which I guess, well, I can't wait to see what happens with itand I can't wait to see what happens with everything you're working on. I Ifeel like they're going to be so many more chances to see you doing so manymore amazing things in the years to come. So now he's been on friends and fiction.So like someone to add to your yearly. So lou it was such a pleasure talkingwith you today about your debut novel and about all these amazing things youhave going on. And as a reminder to all of you out there, please vote for losethe Tinderbox in the Dragon Awards and I would encourage all of you to followlou on twitter where like we said, he's very active and engaged. So, lou,congratulations on this wonderful book and on everything. Thank you so muchfor being with us tonight. Congratulations lou thank you! Thinkthat was amazing. Thank you so much. Yeah, All right, ladies, how fun wasthat for two hours. He was amazing! Oh, that was so much fun, but the fun isnot over. So this is our featuring debut authors and debut books and wehave three more of them coming up. So you won't want to miss it because we'llbe hearing about each of their much anticipated new books. They're writingprocesses and their tips for other aspiring writers and the good news isthat all of these folks will be talking about tonight um will be available fromcopper fish books in punta Gorda on the west coast of florida for 10% off Usingthe code F F 10. This is one of our absolute favorite bookstores. Um andKristen was just there for her tour last month and we'll all be there thisfall as we launch our september and october books. So come see us and inthe meantime support them because they're a wonderful story are they are.And the link to the bookstores under announcements on our facebook page andtonight we are so excited to welcome three new kids on the block, get it newkids on the block, Addison Armstrong, the author of the light of luna park.Haggerty, the author of impolite company and page Crutcher, the authorof the orphan which Addison Armstrong...

...graduated just last year fromVanderbilt University with degrees in elementary education and language andliteracy studies. She's currently living in Nashville working withstudents and obtaining her master's degree in reading education. Her debutthe light of luna park came out just last Tuesday to cover a. It really is. And Haggerty grew upin charleston south Carolina. She earned her B. A. In psychology fromVanderbilt and her M. B. A. From the citadel Military college of southCarolina. That one the one about that one. She has worked as a news reporterand producer, a college instructor and the director of a public speaking lab.She lives in charleston with her husband and daughters. Her debut inpolite company just came out yesterday. Happy but Happy We Page creature hasbeen published in multiple anthologies and online publications and she is aformer southern correspondent for what we call P. W. But is publishers weekly.She's an artist, a yogi and astounding ethereal human being and we're notwriting. She likes to spend her time trekking through the forest with herChildren. She is hunting for portals to new worlds and I actually believethat's what she's doing her work which which I absolutely loved and devouredan advanced topic form and blurbs. Isn't that cover? Amazing. Yeah. is outon September 28, wow. So we cannot wait for all of you to meet the three ofthem. Erica. Can you bring Addison job and page on. Hi hey, hi, good to see you all. Yes,having a oh my gosh! Thank you so much for being here. So welcome ladies andhuge congratulations on your brand new books. So let's start off with a quickelevator pitch from each of you Addison, can you tell us about the light of lunapark which came out just last week. So the light of luna park is a dualtimeline, historical fiction novel and it centers around the 20th centuryconey island baby incubators with like a freak show in a hospital. All rolledinto 1 96 and 1950 timeline with the nurse and teacher. Oh wow, it sounds so good. That'sawesome. And how about you, can you tell us about in polite company whichjust came out yesterday? Yeah, absolutely. I say it's a peek behindthe veil of charleston aristocracy. So you think debutante white glove pearls,but it's not all sweet tea and southern charm. There's a little bit of sexdrugs and rock and roll in there, awesome. And page. Can you tell usabout the orphan? Which, yes, the organ, which is about a woman who has magicalabilities, she doesn't understand and who has never belonged anywhere on anisland off the coast of north Carolina. She finds sisterhood and love and alibrary housing lost magical items. A mysterious and dashing librarian and avery old curse that awakens the power slumbering in her blood. Oh my God, nowalkout Hoffman, here comes these all sounds amazing. Um so ladies,we're going to have a bit of fun for the next few minutes. We have a seriesof questions which we're going to throw it, you rapid fire. So it'll be alittle bit of room to expand later. But this is gonna be kind of like our speeddating ground for our audience of book lovers. So first up, can you tell uswho would love your book Addison? I say book clubs, mom's nurses and teachers.Yeah, anybody who loves charleston south Carolina. And then I'd also sayanybody who loves the protagonist, it's a good girl. That was a rebel heartlike that page. Um I think anybody who loves witches and little bit of magicand sisterhood and found family. Mm Hmm. OK, OK. Round two, we often wonderwhere whether writers outline which we call being a plotter or whether youright by the seat of your pants, which is a panther ladies. How about you? Areyou a play, a plotter or a panther or a hybrid of a total pants, sir. How aboutyou? Page hybrid. Okay, that's a platter. I love learning that. It's sofunny, simply the difference. Okay, how long it take you to write your firstbook from the time you first sat down to put word one on the page. Page. Myvery first book I wrote, I think it took me a couple of years and then theorphan, which it was pretty quick.

About six months, wow. Yeah. Okay, howabout you Addison Madison Esther? I was in school semester during my junioryear. What can you teach us please? How about you jabbing? That was about fouryears. I was working full time as a professor. So that was, it took alittle bit extra time. Okay, okay, he's more normal. That makes me feel alittle bit better about myself. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I'm a littlebit intimidated by page and Addison who are probably gonna put out four morebooks here. OK, 15 tracks a bit. What's the biggest surprise you've experiencedalong the journey to becoming a writer? How about you Addison? I'm shocked bythe fact that I don't hate editing, revising, diving back in and making itbetter. Awesome. Okay, how about you deserve a well, as this is the dayafter my debut launch, I'm just wowed by how much of a business this is asyou very well know, and um yeah, that's probably the biggest part. Cool, okay,how about you page? I think the writing community, honestly, it's so yummy andeveryone's so kind and it's a solitary creative business that we have to sortof discover how wonderful the writers are within it. It's kind of everything.That's awesome. I feel like we've all made that discovery and all been kindof wowed wowed by it, especially I think over this last year and a half.So good to hear you say that. Yeah. Um okay, I love this one. What is one wordthat you hope critics will use again and again to describe your work. It's not like the most imaginative, butI just want them to just say fun a great one page magical. A good oneAddison for help. Oh, okay, ladies or new kids, should I call you? We love togive, we love to have you give aspiring writers a bit of advice each week onthis show way. I took your, I took your Yeah, you're okay. I have a question.It's one thing, a glass of Rombauer and she was like, oh, okay lady, what isthe one thing you have learned along the way that you wish you knew at thestart of this journey page? Uh, it'll be a long journey, but it'll be soworth it. Yes, Addison, you touched on this a little bit, butit is just so much of a business. I thought all the time consuming stuffwould be the actual writing of the novel, but there's so much more Okay,the one thing you wish you'd known it started the journey to just to trust mygut. I think a lot of it is just in here and to trust that. Now, can I askyou now? You can. God all right. So, you know, we want you to give us a bitof writers advice and I think each of you are an awesome position to sharesome words of wisdom with all the writers out there who are seeing youtonight and hopefully feeling inspired. We're gonna ask each of you for aseparate piece of advice and we're gonna start with page I think, wait, Iwant to ask you for advice. Wait, no, I have, I have a specific question to askyou paige, I'm sorry, you ready? Yes, Okay, what's your advice for overcomingthis? This is a very this question is I think they tailored it to me. I havethis voice in my head. What's your advice for overcoming the voice in yourhead at the beginning of your journey that tells you I'm not a writer thatmaybe I'll fail. How do you, how did you overcome that? The inner critic,that tiny little monster. I think I kind of give it a little bit of creditand say, you know what, maybe I can't do this, maybe I won't, but I'm stillgoing to try, like I'm still going to get forward, you know that's greatadvice. Yeah. Um Addison, do you have any advice for people who are lookingto find an agent? Yeah, I think there's just so many waysto do it, depending on what you're comfortable with. So, I mean, they havethe twitter pitched parties, they have the cold emails. I met the woman whobecame my agent melissa anasco at a...

...conference or Writers Institute givinga critique session. So, you know, depending on your strengths and yourweaknesses and what you're comfortable with. There are multiple avenues, greatadvice, okay, like that and job. What is your advice for weathering criticismor rejection or disappointments because they are absolutely no matter who youare. Part of every writer's journey, I, all I can say is put on horse blindersand just charge forward. Yes. Mm that's great advice. Yeah. Okay. Finallyladies, I want you to Bring out your crystal ball 10 years Into the future,pretend you're magical like page would be powers, pretend it's 10 years in thefuture and tell us where you hope to be in your career. I guess I have to ask,let's go job. Why don't you ask answer first? I would love to have about sixbooks under my belt And I also like to move in maybe later to some historicalfiction based in charleston but that would be really fun. Hey, how about you?Um, just to be being published still to be writing and creating more and justhaving fun with it. Yeah, cool Addison. You're bringing up the rear. I'd liketo still be writing also and teaching historical fiction. So, but I'd alsolike to do Children's middle grades like that. Oh, that's awesome. Yeah,that that's a great goal. Wonderful. Alright, well tonight we are going toplay a little game with all of you were going to read nine surprising factsabout our guest authors and their books. You out there, all of you who arewatching on facebook and Youtube have to guess which fact applies to whichnovelist. So you're gonna put your answers in the comments on facebook andYoutube. So when we say question one you put which author you think it is.Question to so on and so forth. Um and we are going to draw one lucky winnerwho will win one book of his or her choice from Jared Addison or pageshipped to you straight from copper, copper fish books. So your answersdon't have to be right, you just have to play and our wonderful meg walker,the driving force behind Friends and fiction will be drawing a random winnerfrom everyone who participates. Okay, you guys ready? We're ready. All rightmary. Kay well and how about we do it like this? Well, read the fact we'llgive everyone just a few seconds to respond and then we'll let the authorown up to who it is. Alright, alright, okay. Question one, this author speaksenglish spanish and a tiny bit of american sign language. I used to knowI took it in school because my language or I don't know. Oh my gosh, I justwatched a movie called coda which is on apple and apple. Tv. It is so good. Ithas lots of sign language in it. It's amazing. But anyhow, sorry, anybody gota guess about who it is. Way it's okay. Wait, this is a way so this authormakes in this is question number two. So put it to in the comments whenyou're answering it. This author takes improv classes because she finds ithelps her right? Dialogue. Taking an improv class literally makes me feelpanicked. It's funny. I think I'd be really bad at improv, but I really lovethe idea of it. I like you would get you know who I bet would be great atimprov. Probably lou diamond phillips. I think that we're diamond phillipswould win. Okay, who is it? Which one of you? Okay. And that it be a Okay,this is fab. This author was a middle school wrestling manager. This is myson wrestled. I do not remember girl wrestling managers. I know that. That'sawesome though. Yeah. Alright. Looks like really cool. I love these fun bags.They always make me think like I really need to step up my fun bags. I thinkmaybe I'm just not that interesting. I know all three of them are sointeresting. I might. They all sent me a bunch of facts and I was like, how doI choose which ones? They're all really cool. I know. All right. Own up to that.All right. I love that. This author...

...doesn't drive a car. Now. This isquestion number four. And you know, when we played fun facts a couple ofweeks ago, I think everybody was Disturbed to find out. I didn't get mydriver's license until I was 21. We couldn't believe it. We didn't knowthat about her to be here. Probably. I still get lost. All right. Give me adriver's license to drive a car. Yeah. Do you have adriver's license? Yes, I do. You do have a uh Yeah. All right, okay. Thisauthor was in 11 plays and musicals in Middle School and High School. It's notme. Well, you're not saying so. I'm sure you thought that musical. I thinkit was crispin Kristen is no, chris, Christie is not eligible. No, No. Ican't act anyways. Yeah. All right. Who was that? Who was who was the uh Okay.And that's interesting because we were just talking with liu about how actingand um falling into character roles helped him a little bit with developingcharacters in his books. I wonder if the same was true with you Addison. Ifthat if that was kind of part of your journey I definitely heard to me. And Ithought also even just like psychology classes that I've taken and things likethat, seemingly totally disparate experiences. That totally makes sense.Absolutely. Okay. I love this one. This author runs most of her errands on acargo bike, which I'm really into and like living in Bedford. I could do that.I really need to be better. I have like a little basket on my bike thatsometimes I'll like right around town and do things, but I need to be morelike intentional about that. I feel like, you know, I feel like it adds tothe mystique of like that crazy author who rides around town on her bike withall her like stopping it. Right. I mean, everyone knows you like, can I followyou around playing do Alright, okay. Is that all right? You inspired major bay?I'll send you the pictures next. Yeah. Right around your planet. Do you alsonot drive a car or do you just choose your bike most of the time? I chooseI'm on the city's bicycle and pedestrian advisory committee. So I'mreal committed to transportation and so yeah, That's great. Well, and then youknow what you're talking about because you're actually doing it. I'm doing it.I think I have to get a car for the tour. But yeah, like you support thatdecision. It's going to be hard to ride a bike to Atlanta where you and I aregoing to get together. Okay, question # seven. Someone in this author's bookwrites a classified ad in the paper looking for a husband. Oh, I love that.Uh, I used to take classified. I worked at a newspaper in ST pete, my hometownAnd I took classified ads and you've got some really squirrely people comingin there. I mean, this was this was in the 70s. My job offer was right. Yeah.Not the same, but also great. Alright. Whose whose book does that happen inAddison? Okay, Okay, fantastic. Okay. In this book, the main character. Iknow this one. The main character caught in a riptide. Well, I hate tosay you know all of them since we have the answers. Yeah. I it actually putthe answers in the script patty. I know you don't know that she takes a littlebit of fun out of it for us. I'm sorry everyone I work for my question andpeter and I'm going to sleep in your guest house. What are you gonna do? Idon't know. Okay. All right. Who is that? Alright. Survey. Okay. All right.And finally I bet you can narrow down that last answer. Okay, so in thisauthor's book, the main character falls in love with the art of tai chi, isthat good? It's not how you do time. I I I don't know the only I rememberdoing a class one time and the only thing I remember is they were talkingabout moving your hands across the velvet. That's all I ever Okay. Thereare a lot of people here that do it like in the park and it's Yeah, theylook really cool when they're doing well, I agree. Okay, whose book is that?I know, I know you probably narrow it down page. Fantastic. Alright, well,how fun was that? We will be bringing...

...our partner in crime meg walker on soonto announce the randomly drawn winner. So don't go anywhere all of you outthere, but ladies, the three of you deserve a Addison page. Thank you somuch for hanging out with us tonight. We are thrilled about your debuts. Wehope everyone watching tonight buys them preferably from copper Fish whereyou can get 10% off with code f f 10 and we all wish you huge success withthese books and with you guys are awesome. You guys are greatlyessentially a we cannot wait to see what your career is take you. So againfolks out there out now are the light of luna park by Addison Armstrong andin polite company by jerry Haggerty and on september 28th the world will meetthe orphan, which by page Crutcher but you can absolutely preorder it now andwe suggest that you do so Addison Jeff and paige, thank you so much forjoining us. Thank you for joining. Thanks guys, y'all are so great, thiswas so fun. Thanks Alright, so to everyone out there,stick around because we'll be naming the winner from the game we played injust a minute and you won't want to miss our after show. But first a fewquick announcements. Don't forget to check out our friends and fictionpodcasts. Not only are the shows on there, but also our every fridayWriter's Block podcast with Ron Block. This past week we had an episode ondiverse voices with Ron Block and he talked to Monica West and he talkedabout revival season and wanda Morris to talk about all her little secrets. Ihave heard it and it is such a powerful episode in this coming friday be andChristie and Ron talked to Allison Larkin about her novel and Tracy langabout her debut. We are the brennans. So just search for friends and fictionon your favorite podcast platform or head over to friends and fiction dotcom and click on podcasts and there's a play button right there to learn more.Yes. So don't forget to like follow and review all the things. Listen right. Yeah,obviously. And if you're not hanging out with us in the Friends and fictionofficial book club yet you are missing out this group which is separate fromus but it's run by our friends lisa Harrison and Brenda. Gartner is nowmore than 8000 strong group you're starting, started reading patties thebookshop at waters and and I know she'll be popping in live on september20th. Take your questions. Speaking of september, did you know that PattyChristie and I all have books coming out between september 28 in october 26.We do, yes. We talked to buy this new, yep, shocking news. Right? You can beamong the very first to read these books through the winter wonderlandsubscription box and you will receive all the books as they released alongwith lows of exclusive extra swag. The package is available for purchase onlythrough our friends at Nantucket Book part partners. Look for the link underannouncements and this sunday and join us at five p.m. For a bonus episodethat's going to blow your mind especially if you're a writer like set11 alarms and do not, Yes, john Truby and Leslie Lear and next Wednesday meetus right here at seven p.m. To welcome back one of our most memorable guestsof 2020 Karin slaughter. Um and there could be some questionable language sowe cannot control so you might want to cover your ears or um fast forwardthrough the bad. But our 2020 episode included pirate hats in a very seriousdiscussion about pirate healthcare. So you do not want to miss her return tothe show and don't forget that we have a merchandise line through independentbookstore. Oxford exchange where you can pick up wine tumbler, stainlesssteel, travel cops and friends and fiction teeth and you might want to goahead and get those friends and fiction tease ordered up because I'm going to,we're going to be announcing something soon that you're gonna want to be apart of it and I like it and you know what? They're all the we all have thoseteas too. So it's the ones that were where we'll be wearing it on the showprobably next. But yeah, well that sounds great. All right ladies, what anight. So may walker are managing Director extraordinaire who keeps ourtrain on the tracks meg! Would you like to come on and announce our winner forthe little game we played tonight. God like hair looks great as usual.It's awesome. That's great. Okay Meg do I have adinner for tonight. Yeah, well I did too much homework and I wrote down athe right person for each of the nine...

...questions, but I'm so sorry. We're notexplaining that to you, That's me, not following directions. So, but I'm goingto say that the winner is the Roebuck. Uh you're in part because I have todioxins and one of them the same disease. So there you go. Love it. It'sgreat. You have Meg's dog's name, that's how you work your name. Youafter Meg's dialogue. Your your parents had excellent foresight. So is heCongratulations. Um reach out to one of us if you can and if we don't hear fromyou will reach out to you and get you all set up with that prize. We'llfigure out which book you would prefer. And that my lovely ladies brings theshow to a close And we do hope you consider picking up the debut novels ofall four of our guests including lou diamond phillips wherever books aresold but preferably from our friends at copper fish books. So stick aroundafter the show for the story. Point sip and stay after show where we dish aboutour guests and make sure to come back this sunday at five for john truby andLeslie Lear And next Wednesday at seven as we welcome special guests Karinslaughter. So stick around for the after show. We'll see you in a second,Goodnight, good night night. Everyone saying in a minute. Yeah, what a night, what a night. Sofirst welcome to our friends and fictions soup and stay with storypoints after show. We are so happy to be partnering with story point wines asthe official sponsor of our after show all summer long. It will be the summerof story point here on Friends and fiction as they say at story point manygreat stories and ideas unfold over a shared bottle of wine as did Friends inFiction. That's true. Every night through the end of august we hope youwill stick around for the Friends and fiction front. I knew they shouldn'thave trusted you with I'm doing it. I'm fiction after show so you can sip andstay with story points okay with you. Yes. Well what a night that was amazing.Kristen I felt like before the show just for everybody like watching,having that many guests is stressed really stressful, especially for thehost and I felt like we needed to play like eye of the Tiger for you. Likemidway through. I mean you really nailed that. It was great. You pumpedup your Alabama Erica. You did it behind a stars. I mean, I, we, I wishwe dared show up a pre show because before you all came on when you sang abomba for us. Oh my gosh, I know it was amazing. It was like sort of kidding. Isaid we have a few minutes to kill. How about we seeing Obama and then he didit and with a little dance and with the whole spanish part amazing. I know theonly reason it shouldn't be on camera because we actually danced and it wasgood. Are you saying we're not talking about we're not triple threat. Iactually don't think I'm a single threat can sing dance. Not she'sdepressing. Eagle watches out right? Like what is it? The Emmy grammy OscarTony right. Greatest guys I guess just like the other three novelist likedrive and Addison and page he had to figure out how to get his bookpublished. He got rejected Right just because you are on every TV screen from1980 to 2020. It really is. We just say like Oh here's my book, you can't know,I loved hearing that and I wish we'd had a little bit more time. We werekind of I know we were all really conscious of the clock because wewanted to make sure we have time for everything. I would have loved to askhim a little bit more about that. Um but if there was a polite way to saylike how does it feel to be lou diamond phillips and to have someone say no youknow what I mean? Because you are in a world of yes well in some ways but thenyou know now that I'm thinking about it, I'm sure there have been roles he'sbeen turning so it's probably something he has learned over the years. But yeah,it is it's interesting to hear though that the doors don't just open but youguys, I don't know if any of you looked him up on imdb I was writing the intro,he has literally been on everything like I don't even think I can think ofa show that aired on television that lou diamond phillips has not gueststarred on at some point. I mean his body of work is astounding. It makes methink of taylor Jenkins Reid last week when she the quote that she uses ofeverybody wants to be Cary Grant Grant.

Cary Grant said even I want to be Iwonder if lou feels that way like okay, so that's separate and that you know.Yeah, because he said uh exhausting. Yeah, real and yes. Sweet. Yeah, No,you're absolutely right. And the friend who introduced us which is how he woundup coming on the show, the friend I mentioned Michelle um that was thefirst thing she said when she brought him up. Not, I mean she said he wrote abook but she said the reason you should have him is because he's warm and kindand nice and like and you can see that you know, you can see that on the showbut I feel like even if you spend a half hour reading through his twitterfeed um he's just a good guy, he does so much to support teachers. Um He uhhe talks about cats all the time. He's just yeah, he's friends with chrisBohjalian like christmas tree, you know when I was interested in um was notjust the successes that he talked about failures because none of us havesuccess until we, until we've experienced failure until we'veexperienced rejection. And I've heard so many stories over the years, it'sit's actually kind of a funny, funny genre of the book business abouteditors saying well I turned down such and such book and you know, look what agiant idiot I was for saying no to that. Like Margaret Mitchell apparently hadjust like scrapbooks full of rejection letters from editors saying no, nothanks. But I always think about the help. I mean, I mean I can't rememberhow many times she said that book was rejected, but remember listening to aninterview like when I was trying to get published and being like okay, allright, you know, even that book was rejected a bunch of I wonder how manyof these debut novelists went through, right um to get their first um and thatgiddy feeling when your first book is coming out. Uh huh. Everybody who's hadnovels rejected oh gosh, yeah I had a manuscript before, oh this isgreat, yeah, I had a manuscript before dear Carolina that I signed with aliterary agent for. And I mean, you know, I, kind of look backand I'm like, I don't know if eventually, maybe it would have foundan editor, but Dear Carolina wanna writing. But I mean, it has certainlybeen rejected a handful of times. And then I randomly got this contract foryour Carolina through a contest. But, like, it definitely, yeah, I felt thefeeling, remember my agent being like, you're going to get rejected a lot.Like, you know, I mean, I remember getting my fifth rejection and beinglike, so are we done? And he was like, uh, no, probably, what about you getrejected? Oh, gosh. I mean, I'm sitting here feeling that weird pit in mystomach. Um My first novel Um was my 4th novel. I talked about that a lot.So, and then when my agent decided to take my first novel out, I mean, it wasrejection rejection. And I did the same thing, Christie, I was like, I guessit's just not gonna work. Maybe we should do what she was like, we are notdone. I remember getting the call. So, and then what's crazy y'all and whatwriters out there needs to know, probably for the same for everybody,every single rejection had a different reason you in and fix everything.Everybody said you can't because they're all different one. Personthinks it's to this and the other person thinks it's too that so,rejection patty, Do you want to hear something funny? Someone, you know,someone that rejected? Well, it's it's like a specific to you story. But yes,it's for everybody. But it's specific to you. The editor, there was an editorthat we pitched to that said, um, that she really liked Dear Carolina becauseI guess did we go out on sub for that after? I don't know, I don't rememberthe timeline. But anyway, um, that said that she had just published a storyabout adoption and it was yours. Yeah. Because like I just Dear Caroline likeright now it's not funny. I mean wildly different. I mean like I feel like theplot lines are like, you know, very different, but still they were bothlike centered around adoption. Yeah. I think everybody out there wants to knowthis really important newsflash Sean is saying hello to all of us from hisvacation at the beach. Fine, fine. You give a shout out to Erica though whofilled in from for Sean tonight? Uh, on...

...a really on a tough night. We threw alot after she rocked it. Absolutely. Yeah. Thank you chris did you haverejection letters? Yeah. You know my first book that I wrote was nonfiction.Um, it was a guide to survival guide to your twenties. Um, and that is how Igot my first literary agent who signed me for that book and then said, um, Idon't think I can take this book out because it's kind of stupid and you're23 you have no idea how to survive your twenties. Um but it was well writtenand I'd like to see what else you can do. So that's how my shouldn't evenshop it. She was just like, yeah, this was dumb, I should have told you thatbefore, such, oh my God, after you wrote the book, she told me it was dumb.You know, I think I had written sample chapters in an outline, but you know, Isigned thinking like fantastic, we're going out with this survival guide yourtwenties and she was like, no, no, no, what else happened for me? Well youknow, I was still a newspaper reporter and I had this great idea. I hadcovered two of the murder trials that eventually were the basis of MidnightMidnight in the Garden of Eden, a little book in Savannah, I can't movethem as a reporter for the newspaper. And so I had this idea and um through,through contacts, I found a guy who was a pretty big literary agent in new yorkand he had a friend at harpercollins and it happened to be my dear friendCelestine is publisher and editor at harpercollins. And so Larry loved theidea, I was going to write a book about these two murder trials and about thecase. Yeah, so Larry jed Madison, he's his name and um Larry took it to theway it works at big publishing houses is an editor that wants to acquire abook, takes it to the meeting and they go around the table and they talk aboutyou know, this, I want to acquire this book. And Larry said this this reporterin Atlanta covered these two murder trials very sensational and I think itwill be a great true crime book. And someone else said, well yeah, that'sgood. But there's this guy named john Barrett who wrote a story or I thinkhe'd written a story for GQ maybe about it. And um and he had a contract. Andso they all went, yeah, I know that this this chicken Atlanta. No. So umyou know, my whole thing that I had pinned everything on well apart becauseit fell apart. So I started writing another mystery. This was a true, thiswas a mystery set in Savannah where I had worked as a newspaper reportbecause I was fixated on Savannah and with that same um publisher, with thesame editor at harpercollins, but a different agent and he rejected it andand other editors rejected it. But out of that I got my first agent. That'sawesome. You have had to listen to all of us been rejected. So what from anoutsider's point of view? Like I'm laughing because I worked in a housefor so long and I, you know about all that happened when you said they tookit to the meeting? I was I was thinking to myself, yeah. They call that the aced meeting. Ac is a Q which stands for acquisitions. And there was one ofthose every, you know, week and then there was also the slush pile meetingwhich they made the editorial assistance, read the unsolicitedmanuscripts that were, you know, you always hear those like crazy stories oflike somebody discovered somebody in the slush pile. Like I think that'swhere J. K. Rowling was discovered in this Nicholas Sparks. Yeah. Was anagent slush pile who died. Oh my gosh, his assistant was like his assistantwas Teresa Park. I mean superstar agent. Yeah wow. So Maggie, you've listened tothe other side where it's just like rejection. We're over here like icepicking apart and there at the table. Not that, not that I know. So do youthink about that like when you're on your end of it, are you thinking abouthow is telling us now is going to shatter our hopes and dreams? No,because I feel like when I work for authors, I'm there to tell them yes,I'm not there to tell them no. And but if I wouldn't choose to work on a bookum to do the marketing and pr for a book if I didn't believe in it. So I amthere to market it like it's the next biggest bestseller regardless of whatit is. Absolutely no, I'm not in the business of telling you guys know we'rebreaking your heart. You've got, you've gone through all of that before youcome to know and exactly when you were on the table, like when he was goingdown the table, like at the act meetings, was it? I mean I didn't go tothose because I worked in marketing, so I wasn't, in fact, but I would I hadfriends who were editorial assistance...

...and they would go to that meeting inthe slush pile meetings and stuff. Maybe I was jealous of the slush pilemeetings because they got them free pizza, a port 24 year old rugby becauseit was like three pizza. How do I get in on that? Like a bag. Was there evera book that you were handed to market that you thought God, this thing is abomb, it's never going to go anywhere and it took off and it was like a shockto you. Well, you know, we worked on this isit's not fiction and it's not whatever, but there's a little book called whomoved my cheese or you guys familiar with? Yeah, so it became this hugephenomenon and no one expected it and I was working at putting them at the timeand you know, it just started selling like crazy. And so again, another namefor one of these group meetings, Phyllis Grant who ran put them at thetime, said we're going to put together a group of people were going to callyou the cheese board and we're going to make you come up with ideas for what todo with this book. I want cheese board that comes with the planning meetingand tell us what we're going to do with this runaway success. I uh I don't andwhy is it? And she's like, don't call it dumb. It's keeping the lights on.All right. That is incredible though. I mean, I, you know, and you hear peoplesay that all the time, like if we knew what was going to be a big hit, that'sall we would publish, yep, that's true. Yeah, but let's be that, let's be that.All right. Let's be let's be the cheese. Yeah, rotary board. Yes. The author whorequires their own board within the Yeah, Right charcuterie board. I want to be theauthor that requires a board of any kind. Speaking of charcuterie boards, Ineed to go eat something before you and I will see you all at the Friends andFiction board meeting in the morning charcuterie. Thank you. IOC everyone.Thanks Erica. Thanks Good night. Mhm. Thank you for tuning in, Join us everyweek on Facebook or YouTube where our live show airs every Wednesday night atseven p.m. eastern time. And please subscribe to our podcast and follow uson instagram. We're so glad you're here.

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