Friends & Fiction
Friends & Fiction

Episode · 3 months ago

Friends & Fiction Launch Party for Kristin Harmel's The Forest of Vanishing Stars

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

The Fab Five celebrate the launch of Kristin Harmel's The Forest of Vanishing Stars by putting on a short, stirring, and emotional Broadway-style mini-musical (with a gravitas that honors the subject matter) written and composed by the uber-talented Kristin Harmel. Special musical guests include Broadway actress Christina Sivrich Grammy-nominated singer-songwriter Stephen Kellogg, and F&F’s behind-the-scenes A/V whiz Shaun Hettinger, composer of TV theme songs and the lead singer of the band MEMORYY. Later in the episode, the authors are joined by bestselling author Susan Elizabeth Phillips along with Brenda & Lisa of the The F&F Official Book Club who each present an original cocktail recipe inspired by Kristin's book.

Welcome to Friends and Fiction. Fivebest selling authors and the stories. Novelists, mary Kay andrews, ChristineHarmel, Christie Woodson, harvey patty Callahan, Henry and mary Alice Munroare five longtime friends with more than 80 published books to their creditIn 2020 they created friends and fiction to provide author interviewsand fascinating insider, talk about publishing and writing and to highlightindependent bookstores. These friends discuss the books, they've written thebooks they're reading now and the art of storytelling. If you love books andyou're curious about the writing world, you're in the right place. Hi everyoneand welcome such an incredibly special night of friends addiction. It's thefinal summer launch for one of our novels. But tonight we are so thrilledto be celebrating the launch of the Forests of Vanishing Stars by our veryown Christine Harmel. A story of survival and hope and love set deep inthe forest of Eastern europe during World War Two. In an honoring of thisastounding book based on a very real piece of World War Two history, Kristenhas accomplished an amazing feat of creativity. We have all tried to launchour spring and summer books with imaginative episodes and it's beenamazing. But for tonight, not only has Kristen written this powerful book, butnow she has written a stirring and emotional 15 minutes, many musical thattells a bit of the story of the forest of vanishing stars. Or while it is alsoan honoring of the real life refugees whose resilience and bravery is aninspiration to all of us. So yes, you heard that, right? We're staging adramatic musical. So without further ado, I'm Patty Callahan and I loved thebeautiful question at the Heart of the Forest Vanishing Stars, which is how dowe figure out who we are? How do we come to become who we are meant to be?And can we go beyond the definitions that have been placed upon us by otherpeople? Hi, I'm mary Alice Monroe and I loved the really vibrant descriptionsof nature that radiate from the page from the forest itself, which was ameaningful part of the refugee survival. Yeah, I'm mary Kay andrews and I wastransfixed by the twists and turns of this pot, which takes us from akidnapping in a german city, to underground bunkers in the polish woods,to a church hiding secrets in a Nazi occupied town. I'm Christi Woodsonharvey and I loved the characters who are realistic and conflicted and tornbetween love, hate, regret and hope. I'm Christine Harmel and I'm the authorof The Forest, Vanishing Stars And this is friends and fiction, five New YorkTimes, bestselling authors, endless stories, questionable ability toharmonize, which is why tonight it will be spot on that one. Why tonight wewill be welcoming a few special guests who will be taking over most of thesinging duties. But you will hear us sing a few lines and as you know, it'sso important to all of us to support our local independent bookstores. Andtonight, Kristen has chosen writer's block in Orlando is her launch partner,which is a favorite of all of ours. That only will every copy of the ForestVanishing Stars come signed by Kristin. But the 1st 50 orders will also comewith one of these wish bracelets that I have. You know where the beautifulbeautiful bracelet and it's so comfy. I'm like about when it falls off mywish to come true. So and a five by seven art print. You can order any ofour new releases from writer's block at 10% off the code preordered 2021. Ifyou order by tomorrow at noon Eastern, that's thursday july 8th at noon. Youcan also ask the store to have christian personalize your copy of theForest Vanishing Stars for you. Just put your personalization request in thecomments. That's beautiful. And don't forget to stick around for the aftershow tonight For us here at Friends and Fiction. This is the summer of StoryPoint and we are celebrating with in...

...the after show the sip and stay withstory point and I hope you and your friends have a tumbler like we did. Yeah. Thisweek's Friends and Fiction parade? S a pray dot com essay was written byKristin who talked about resilience and letting the hard times make us stronger.Yeah. I talked a bit about my interview with 94 year old holocaust survivorerin Bielski who I talked to as part of my research for the Forest VanishingStars. There were several things he said that stuck with me but one inparticular I think is really applicable to this tough last year and a half.We've all been through hardship. He said teaches a person life. How aboutall of you can you share one thing you learned from the last year that willteach you how to live a better life going forward. I think I learned thatI'm a lot more flexible than I thought I was and that's something I can accessany time. Like no matter what's going on, no matter if it's just like a sillydeadline thing or if it's you know a huge pandemic, like that's somethingthat's available and you know, I can get it any time I need it. That'sawesome for me. It's this cliche I've heard my whole life which is you knowthis too shall pass and you'd never believe it when you're in the middle ofsomething. But I think what this year has taught us is that it's a clichebecause it's true. This too shall pass. Okay for me. It's what I've been saying.It's to live each day to the fullest can't plan for the future. You don'tknow what's going to happen tomorrow, so enjoy the here and now. Yeah, Ithink the lesson I learned was that we really are stronger together. Um youknow, we really are the sum of our parts and I think of course when westarted friends in fiction, um we hope that was true, but I think we've reallydiscovered it through the 15 or 16 months that we've been doing sostronger better together. Absoluteing. 100% yes, you heard me right at theintro. Tonight is a many musical written by and I am not kidding you?Written and composed by our uber talented Christine Harmel. We have afew guests tonight who are actual professional singers. But the five ofus will be chiming in and when I was in the church choir as a kid, they gave methe talking parts. So you are all right. So I have to give you a little bit ofexplanation. Of course, The Forest Vanishing Stars is about very serioussubject matter refugees who survived in the forests of Eastern europe duringWorld War Two. And we created this mini musical accordingly. So it's basicallya short broadway style, dramatic and emotional retelling of the book whichcame out yesterday. As I mentioned, The Forest add Vanishing Stars is rooted inthe real life stories of jewish refugees in eastern europe who fledinto the forests to escape the Nazis and actually lived through the war.That way. The true stories of groups like those led by the Bielski brothersand by a partisan named Zoran are incredible. And the research into thosegroups and others like them form the backbone of this novel which centersaround an extraordinary young woman named Yona. So without further ado, Ihope you all enjoy The Forest of Vanishing Stars. The musical patty Takeit away. Okay, here goes The Forest of Vanishing Stars openswith our main character, Yona being stolen from the home of her germanparents on her second birthday, her kidnapper, an old woman named Jerushabelieves she has been called by the forest itself to give the girl adifferent future and a different fate. But what she gives Yona instead is alife of isolation in which the owner knows all the survival skills she'llneed in the forest, but almost none of the skills she'll need if she everventures outside the safety of the trees alone in the woods, I find my way thelife I once knew feels so far away to talk to the birds. I talk to the trees.I'm all alone alone. Just me. Oh my goodness, introducing my dear friend,Christina, Sieve Rich, who's broadway credits include Greece and the weddingsinger. She is also toured with broadway across America. Production'sbeen in multiple regional productions...

...and starred in shows for Disney Cruiselines and walt. Disney world. Most recently, she played Dory in Findingnemo, the musical at Disney's Animal kingdom. But tonight she'll be playingthe role of Yona in the Forest, Vanishing Stars, the musical. How luckyare we out here? The world feels so small. Thetrees stretch forever to nowhere at all. I long for a world just out of my grasp.Maybe one day I'll find it at last. At least Jonah had Jerusha who is never amother, never a friend, but at least he's company. Another person to talk to.Then in 1942, Jerusalem dies leaving Yona with a terrible secret and arevelation. I'm someone else's daughter, someone's lostchild. My life was meant for something else. A life across the miles, the U. Turners, she said, the users ofBerlin, but you mustn't ever seek them. There's evil within. Alone in the woods,Jonah wanders lonelier than she's ever been trying to piece together. Thethings Teresa told her after all, she has memories, faces that come to hersometimes in her dreams, the face of a father and a mother, a warm bed, freshmilk. She thought those fleeting images were just wisps of imagination. Butthere were glimpses of the life she should have had. And then one day thelife she does have changes forever. She's wandering her familiar woods whenshe hears a sound and into the clearing stumbles a lost child. I watch for amoment, paralyzed by fear were far from the village. Is what is she doing here?She's crying, she's hurt, she seems to be alone. She's wearing a star andshe's very far from home. Yona has no choice but to help the child. And whenshe does saving her life, she learns that there are horrible, unimaginablethings happening outside the safety of her forest. The Germans have arrivedand they're rounding up the jews, locking them into terrible ghettos ifexecuting some at random, deporting others to their deaths. And once theowner knows, she realizes she cannot turn away, she has to do something tohelp. She feels a calling that she can't explain. Soon Yona meets another group ofrefugees. This one is larger and even more in need of her help. Slowly,reluctantly, she emerges from the woods. Who are these souls who've wandered sofar? They must be lost. They must be scared. Do they know where they are?And that one, there's something about him that draws me right in. I'm frightened, but I have to help. Ihave to go to him. Yeah. Who is this woman emerging from the trees? I'm lostand I'm scared. I cannot lead these refugees, but I promised I'd save them.I promised they'd be free. So why am I so frozen as she slowly approaches me.Ladies and gentlemen, I am thrilled to introduce you to my friend, singersongwriter Stephen Kellogg, who gives incredibly inspiring ted talks, writessongs that receive Grammy nominations, tours the world and is the recipient ofthe Armed Forces entertainer of the Year award. Yep, he's amazing! Andtonight he'll be playing the role of alexander, A young man leading a smallgroup of jewish refugees fleeing the mere ghetto just outside the forestthat Yona calls home, Welcome Stephen, great to be here. Alexander is a goodman, but he's a conflicted 12 Yona is drawn to him from the start and soonshe becomes a part of his group, but it's terrifying leaving behind her lifeof solitude Jerusha always taught her that the only way to survive was tostay steadfastly alone, but johanna realizes that she has a responsibilityWithout her Alexander and his group,...

...which includes three small Children,may not survive the winter. Mhm. So she stays and she helps them to learn toforage for food and how to find shelter when they're deep in the woods, allalone. But she's learning vital lessons to lessons about love and loss and betrayal that will change her worldforever. The winter comes in with it moredangerous than they know. They were fleeing from the Germans. But the newthreat is the snow under blankets of ice. They must eat, they must survive.Perhaps I'm meant to be here, keeping them alive. Inevitably, Yona falls in love withalexander, which changes everything for the first time since she was stolen asa baby, she belongs to someone really belongs as he does to her. But as thebalance of their relationship shifts and a Jonah comes more into her own asa woman and a leader cracks began to form just as they do in the icy streamssurrounding them. I want so much to love her for she'severything to me. But I was taught that to be a man. I should take the lead.She leads us through the forest and she knows more than I. But I matter to youknow, we're not seeing eye to eye still. They keep each other warm at night. AndYona who loves alexander deeply is learning what it means to give and take,not just in terms of love, but in terms of the dynamics of a relationship. Thethings that have brought us to where we are at this point in time, in the deadof that first winter with alexander and his group, Yona is leading anexpedition through the woods one day when suddenly they're confronted by aman with a gun. At first she thinks he's a threat, but then she realizeshe's leading a group of jewish refugees to and there's something about her thatstops him in his tracks. Who is this woman? I'm so brave and sostrong and who are these people following along? I've led my group fromthe ghetto and we're living in fear. We've prayed for a miracle. Could thisbe it right here? Oh my gosh, you guys. It has been a great excitement but Ireintroduce you to Sean heading er are behind the scenes audio video in TechWiz who also releases music as memory spelled with two wise memories. Nextsingle I love You. Maybe drops this friday july 9th on all music platforms.Sean also happens to be the composer of many of the songs you hear on tvincluding the theme music for the Chelsea handler show. But tonight he isZeus who has led a group of refugees from the lead a ghetto into the woods,but is afraid that in the deepest part of winter he won't be able to keep hispeople alive. Yona invites him back to the camp where her group is shelteringfor the winter. But alexander isn't pleased she's putting at us at risk for thesepeople. She doesn't know there's not room for all of us beneath the blanketof snow. I wish things were different. But we're surviving to. We'll all worktogether. Just tell us what to do. We can't turn our backs on them. We mustgive all we can give. You're not the only ones who deserve a chance to live.How easily you talk as if you're not one of us. I thought that you loved me.Did I misplace my trust, you're everything I want, my love. But wecan't do this alone. We must help them survive. We must give them a home,forgive the intrusion. I don't mean to make you fight. It's just that here inthe darkness I hope we could find a light and Jonah is the light. The lightin the darkness. A woman who, despite all the odds, was born to beextraordinary. But here, deep in the forests of eastern europe, here, in thedepths of a long, hard winter here where men, women and Children are beingpursued. There's also a great threat from within. Yeah, I don't understandall the piece of my new life. I thought...

...all we had to do was learn to survive.But it's more than that, don't you see? And though my love runs true, I'm usedto being in charge here and now that leader is you, She is with him and he with her. ThenI'm broken, anyhow. So why am I feeling lost like this? It's too late to turnback now. The betrayals run fast and deep fromthe places you least expect. And when I'm forced to flee the woods, who knowswhat will happen next? Well, we know what happens next. But if you want tofind out, you'll have to read the book which wraps the fictional story of Yonaaround a story of survival as real as the forest itself. In the midst ofWorld War two, thousands of jews fled into the woods of eastern europe andsurvived their living off the land. For more than two years. These incredible survivors vanished asYona does into the depths of the forest. And when the war ended, they emergedinto a world they could not recognize anymore. Kristen captures all of thatand more in this intensely research novel. Okay, and now we'd like to closeout the musical portion of the show with a little message from us into thewoods. We vanish at last. There's light, there's hope, there's magic as weexplore the past here in these pages, you'll find a story lost of faith andperseverance. Whatever the cost, you'll find hope in the darkness, a story oflight, of the beauty of nature and the stars out at night with love andunderstanding. You know, we'll find her away. She'll be right for others asthey survived the days. I hope you will find yourself wherever you are in thestory, the surrounding us, in the Forest of Vanishing Stars. Oh my gosh!Christina's steven Sean, all of you. Oh my gosh, I cannot thank you enough! Ohmy gosh! And to all of you out there, I lost where I was so excited. We haveplenty more coming up later in the show, including a drop in from author, SusanElizabeth phillips. But I cannot let these guys go without asking Stephen tosing a quick song for us. He is absolutely incredible. You guys, as youknow, I just cannot believe we just put on, Oh, that's a big deal. That's myfirst musical since high school. So, oh, that was, that was thrilling. Oh mygosh, you are so good steven. You were so good, Christina, Sean, You guys wereamazing. If you still doing that, you don't Seriously? Oh my gosh, So youguys, Stephen is going to play a song for us now, I'll let him tell you why.But I also wanted to share with you that he's going to be on tour for thenext few months, including a whole bunch of dates with the band, Toad, TheWet Sprocket of Walk On the Ocean Fame, especially, I think in september andoctober, I think that's when you're going to be on the road with them. Yeah,so I hope, I hope that all of you out there will consider catching him on theroad and telling him that you heard him here. So, Stephen, would you do us thehonor of playing for us? I would love to, and I just want to say, well, Ihave the opportunity, you know, thank you kristen for writing these booksthat you write that are beautiful, uh, and entertaining novels, but they alsothey have so much poignancy and you learn so much reading. So we appreciateall that you're giving to the world here. Thank you steven, Thank you somuch. Okay, so yeah, so this is a song that I felt I had quite a few parallels.It's it's I wrote it a few years ago, um and it's a song about about how uhwhen you're feeling hopeless and desperate, you know, and you kind oflook up at that big sky and realize that that sky up above you, you justrealize how very small you are and that can, that can be, that can flatteningor it can be comforting. So I'll let you decide this song is called Orion O brien. I can see you looking downsmall houses that were built into the...

...ground at a distance, You can't seewhat's falling down if you're up close, you can almost hear the sound of some,remember we'll pack our things into the car though we never got too far. It's awonder to discover ways Winter finds its wayto spring. The young man, everything in the way constellations are you laughingat? And so we rage as we watch our heroes fall if they're up there.Remember them to me like my grandpa on the beach of Normandy in the summer. Weremember Ryan Sword is burning out lovers long forgotten now there weremothers who discovered how the winter finds his way to spring. Parents don'tknow everything in some whoa, the stars are still the same. They see all of ourpay. No, they can't do anything and slowly they explode the o brien it to be young and insecure.It's the trade off. It's the cost of wanting more every summer. Remember topack your things into the car and if you never get too far, take a number,discover you'll be doing what your parents did. Don't you dare forget akid in the summer. I remember little Ryan Sword is burning out orwill be forgotten now in someone. Okay. Yeah. Whoa. Oh my God, I'm so emotional,I'm not going to make a difference for this. Oh, Stephen, that was amazing.You're amazing. Oh my God, steven steven, thank you so much for giving usthe beautiful gift of that song and of your talent tonight. Um that wasincredible. And also, I should say thank you to Alison Hammer, who hasbeen our guest in the past. She wrote little pieces of me. She's a very goodfriend of steven's and she's the reason I know, Stephen, so thank you Alisonfor putting us together. Um so all of you out there, I hope you'll check outsteven Kellogg dot com and in fact, I'm gonna give you a reason to do just thattoday. Just so happens to be the one year anniversary of the launch ofsteven's first book, objects in the mirror, thoughts on a perfect life froman imperfect person, which is just an incredible collection of essays. So tocelebrate, it's so good. It's so good to celebrate. I know, I mean can youjust tell he's just the most amazing, overwhelmed. I know I'm overwhelmed tonot myself right now. You guys were going to be giving away four signedcopies of his book sent straight from the Kellogg family store. So to enter,I'm going to put a post under announcements as soon as the show'sover tonight, it'll give you the link...

...to steven Kellogg dot com and here'swhat I want you to do. I want you to tell us in the comments. One thingyou're excited about on his site, it could be that he has an upcoming towardeight near you or that his ted talk sounds really cool. It is. Or that hismerch store is loaded with really cool extras, whatever it is, whatever youlike, share it in the comments and this sunday we're going to draw four winnersfor autographed books. So again, that's going to be under announcements on ourfacebook page right right after the show. Yeah, awesome. Oh, I also hopethat you will follow Christina who I had the joy and pleasure of meeting inperson when Kristen and Meg and I were down in Orlando. Um, Cristina can befound on instagram and X T I N A S I V. That's the letter X. Tina sieve whereshe will lift you and inspire you and keep you updated on all her project.She's also on Tiktok with the same handle. Oh good. Thank you SeanEckstine excessive. If you like quotes and fun videos, you will love her post.And of course how could you not love that beautiful voice. Oh my God, youguys, she's I'm just overwhelmed. I don't even have words tonight, so I'mso excited for you all to get to know her since she's a very good friend ofmine, Christina and I have known each other for years. I'm just so happy.She's a part of this tonight and of course our very own Sean can be foundhere with us every Wednesday and memory music dot com. That's memory with twoeyes where you can learn more about our super impressive man behind the scenes.So don't forget to mark your calendars for this friday july 9th when Shawn'sbrand new single, I love you. Maybe will be available for download whereveryou get your music. So just search for his band Memory with two eyes on any ofthose platforms. I love you guys so much. Thank you so much for joining ustonight. I'm so honored. Thank you for having It was amazing. Thank you So, soincredible. Thank you all very thank you guys look just wonderful feminizing.Oh my gosh, it was so gorgeous. It really was, wow, beautiful. Heartfelt,extremely heartfelt Christina. Had me crying. I have to say Christina's voice.Yeah, I am so glad you had them singing rather than Oh yeah, well, I mean mygosh, I would scare you. Why were they was so talented? I love his voice. Wewe we we we we we talented. I think he's going to be playing network videoon I believe. Okay, okay, super cool. I love it. Atalented, we want to remind you about the talented bookseller at Writer'sBlock who are offering a 10% discount on all of our neorealist releases,including the brand new Forest of Vanishing Stars with coupon code.Preorder 2021 Preorder all caps. Remember every cop copy of Forest thatyou order from writer's block come sign. And if you order by saturday using thatcoupon code refers 50 orders also come with a gift from Kristen to you, abracelet edified by seven art print. And if you order by tomorrow thursdayjuly 8th by noon, you can also ask for your book to be personalized by Kristenwho will be doing a live event in Orlando with writer's block tomorrownight. So if you are one of these people like so many of us are you don'twant just a signed book, you want to sign personalized book, definitely goonto that writer's block page and order your book to be personalized bytomorrow at noon. Absolutely! All right now, you've heard you've all heardabout the plot of Force of Vanishing Stars and Kristen has made us sing. Sonow it's only fair we get to ask for some tough questions about the novel.Are you ready, Kristen? I'll start us off. Okay. Actually, it's going to beso much fun for such a great novel. And all those of you watching tonight. Ifyou have a question for christian,...

...please just plug it into the commentsbelow. And we'll be choosing a few to ask Kristen later in the show. Allright, Kristen you wrote this book during the pandemic. So as far as Iknow, unless you secretly created a major international incident that wasswept under the carpet, you didn't get off to eastern europe for research. Sounless you did. How did you get the setting? So spot I was there. I mean, Iwas being a swamp and in the forest and right there. Thank you. Oh my gosh!Well, first of all, it wasn't the brightest thing in the world. You know,when I pitched this book, I fully intended to do that to go over there.But I hold the book in january and then we all know what happens in the springof this year. Um and I was therefore unable to um I did months worth ofreading about specifically about the forest and I found this wonderful bookabout the flora, fauna and human history of the forest. That was anacademic book of that specific forest. It was an academic book that gave me somuch of what I needed. But there was still more, I needed to put kind of thesmells and the actual site. I mean just those things that you only really getfrom going there. Right, so I contacted the author of that book who happens toalso, in addition to being a PhD in an author, he's an ecotourism guide wholeads, who leads guided journeys into the forest. Um he became my go to foreverything. Um I paid him by the hour because there's no way I could havejust asked him these things and expected him to do it out of kindness.Um but I would send him 20 questions today, things like, well, okay, Iunderstand that they made mud mud bricks to make their structures out of,but how are the mud bricks made? And he would send me photographs of molds, ofmud bricks from the 19 forties that he found in the forest, Or how do you diga shelter in the ground? And he would go out into the forest and send mepictures of, of shelters that had been there for 70 years. I really thoughtabout that. I mean that's really the shelters. It was amazing. All of it wasso interesting. But everything I needed to know he knew and if he didn't knowwhat he'd find the answer. And if I didn't understand that he would go outin the forest and send me pictures of him doing the activity or so. I mean,what a great person. Godsend. And I could not have written this bookwithout him. So through Vadim Fedorovich, I traveled to the Nahlabaki forests and then some well done. We did not get to go virtually to thenah Labaki forest Kristen, but we were all with you as you wrote this book. Infact, one thing many people out there might not know is that all five of uswrote our books together over the last year by doing virtual writing sprintstogether every morning. So we all know a bit about your research. So manymornings, Kristen would have this lame excuse about, oh, I'm doing research.Yeah. But you spent the morning. Yeah, yeah. While the rest of us where someof us are making coffee, Kristen was interviewing people's in Poland. Butyou talked about getting forest. Right. How did you get the other stuff? Butthe actual refugees are going through. I mean, did people actually survivedthis way for years in the woods without the german finding them? You know, thereal stories are incredible. And they did. There were thousands of people whosurvived the war that day. Which that way, which is which is mind blowing. Imean, to think about fleeing into a forest and staying on the move when youneeded to, but also setting up a society. I mean, it was absolutelyincredible. Um, so fortunately for me, there's been lots written about thelargest group of those refugees, which is called the Bielski group. Um and infact there is a 2000 and eight movie called defiance, which stars DanielCraig. That is about the Bielski group. So that's a great starting point. Ifyou're interested in finding out more, That was a great starting point for me.It's based on a nonfiction book of the same name. But there are memoirs, theresurvivor testimony. I mean there's just so much to go through. So I felt like Ihad accumulated all these details, but it all came together for me when I hadthe opportunity to interview a man named erin Bielski who was the youngestand the only surviving Bielski brother, he was one of the brothers who led thisgroup of 1200 That survived the war. Um he was 14 when he fled into the forest.He's about to turn 94. So this was 80 years ago. He survived 80 years pastwhen when the Germans came to take him away. He he he hidden a barn andescaped the Germans that way. His parents were executed. He survived and80 years later he's still here. Um it just, it gave a beating heart to thiscollection of details that I had accumulated and it was, it was such anincredible gift to me. I remember that...

...day. That was so incredible. Oh my gosh,yes, I was, I was all right away. Yeah, it was like, what's so great. Well, Ialso love the story or maybe non story of where this book came from, parentwith the discovery that you made midway through writing it. So, can you tell usabout how you came up with the idea to write a book set in the polishwilderness? Yeah. You know, I wish I had a better answer for that, but it'skind of one of those situations where, where the pieces of the book just cameto me as I was researching other things. So, like I said, I had seen the moviedefiance back in probably 2009, right after it came out. So I kind of vaguelyknew the story of the Bielski brothers and I have been very, very inspired byit. But when I started working on this book, I had no idea that the Jewishside of my own family, on my dad's side actually came from Poland, not that farfrom where the book takes place. So those were the actual harm Als in myfamily, it's where my last name comes from. Um, they were the harm als whobrought the family name over to the United States just before the turn ofthe last century. They were my grandpa as grandparents. Uh, Rosie and Rudolphfor their names and my grandpa, grandmother Rosie uh, wound up goingback to europe in 1933 for a visit at the age of 69. So six years before thewar began and actually eight years before she passed away. Um, so I'm sureit had to have been her going back to visit loved ones, um, which makes mefeel so sad because think how she must have felt in the final years of herlife just a few years later to realize what was happening to these people,she'd left behind these people, she knew she would never see again. Um youknow, I mean in this country in europe where there was a higher um number ofjews murdered than anywhere else. So it was extraordinary to learn that I hadthis family connection to it and that I have been writing this story before. Iknew any of that before. I knew that connection to the past. So it's amazingand it still gives me goose bumps to think about it. That's what it feelslike. I mean, so personal to it did, it felt really personal because you guysknow, I mean I write about France, this was very odd for me, very, verydifferent for me, but it kind of makes me think that there are stories thathave been living in our blood all along, just waiting to be told. I do believethat I do kristen I mean when I whenever we hear and it's happened toall of us and all of our guests and these things that happened that say youknow what, you're on the right path, don't give up its astounding. I knowone of the things that I took away from the book, um I talked about it at thebeginning, it's this idea of how do we let people define ourselves, define us?Do we take on these labels that other people give to us? But it's also thissense of hope and looking at the idea of community and helping our brothersand sisters and not believing what other people say we are. What do youhope readers take away from both up this book other than how to catch fishthrough what you know, you never know when you might never know that survivalskills is just stuck with me. I know I have to forget it. Are there a lot ofice holes in Orlando kristen? I'm just, I was out fishing in one case, afreezer. What do I hope people take away from this book other than theobvious survival skills? I hope that people take away the idea that there'salways light in the darkness that there's always hope. Um, and then weall have these vast reserves of strength that we may not know aboutuntil our backs are up against the wall. Um, and I also hope that you take awayfrom this, as Erin Bielski said, um, we talked about this earlier when wementioned the parade essay, he said that hardship teaches a person life andhelps us to move into a better future. And I think that's especially animportant lesson um for the here and now. So I hope that's something youtake away from it too. It's amazing. So folks, I need you to stick aroundbecause we have some really special guests about to drop in who you do notwant to miss. And then we're closing with another musical number. I'm noteven kidding. We have a few final announcements and trust me, he'll wantto stay because tonight we're closing in song. I don't know. We might nottell them that they might leave. You leave like a mass exodus. Like rememberif tonight's musical intrigued you. Do you consider purchasing the ForestVanishing Stars this week? I know we've said it before, but I'm gonna say itagain, a books first week of sales is so incredibly important to itstrajectory and to our authors and Kristen does so much for all of usweekend and we got to make friends and...

...fiction happen. So, um, tell her thankyou by buying her book this week. It's beautiful. You will love it. You will.Thank us for buying it. Um, but please do because it's wonderful. Absolutely.Please do. It's a wonderful book. You will thank us. All right. So you knowabout our podcasts and the same friends and fiction podcast with a new name.Friends and Fictions Writers black podcast with our own Ron Black. Andlast week mary Kay Andrews interviewed Cindy Spiegel and julie Grau abouttheir new publishing line and the novel The Fox and I, which is another book onmy list to read this week. Patty and Ron interview to authors in theirorigin story series Susan Cushman and lisa Patton who both wrote about theUniversity of Mississippi in different decades. Our podcast is such a greatway to connect with even more authors. And guess what? Speaking of our podcast,it has been nominated for not one but two people's Choice awards. Were soexcited and we would love it if you would vote for us. So um yes, we'vemade a post. It's under our announcements on facebook and it tellsyou exactly how to vote, but you can visit podcast awards dot com and youclick the blue button and you just enter your information that says signup to nominate and you can vote for us in both the adam curry people's choiceaward category and the arts category and you just have to make sure youclick save nomination. It takes less than a minute. We would be so gratefulbecause we will win. We always want to win. Winning, always want to, I want towin. Um but also don't forget we do have amazing merch. I think mary Alicehas her wine sippy tonight with her. She could hold it up. We also have, oh,christian does too. We also have some amazing coffee tumblers and t shirtswere working on, y'all, some merge. That's gonna blow your mind. One pieceof particular that we cannot wait to announce super soon. So we're soexcited. Stay tuned, you can find all of our merch on Oxford Exchange'swebsite and also at Friends and Fiction dot com. And of course, don't forget tojoin the Friends and Fiction official Book Club, if you haven't already. It'sa separate group here on facebook run by our friends, Brenda, Gartner andlisa Harrison and it's a more personal into it can't for readers to chat witheach other. So this month there in the midst of reading mary Alice is thissummer of Lost and Found, and she'll be joining them on july 19th to chat aboutit. Starting right after that, the group would be reading The Forest ofVanishing Stars, which hopefully everybody will have a copy of afterthis time. You know, if for no other reason than to fund singing lessons forme in the future. Um, and we'll be dropping by in a facebook live chat onaugust 16th with the Book Club to tell you all about the book and to answeryour questions and you are going to really want to be with us next week onFriends and Fiction right here at seven p.m. Wednesday night, we're thrilled towelcome new york times bestseller Paula McLain, author of the paris wife, withher astounding new novel, When the Stars Go Dark, whenever, where neveryou are interested, you want to sing if you are interested. I think that's not.Um, whenever you're interested about our upcoming guests, you can visit ourwebsite or check on the sidebar on our facebook page and you will not believewho we have coming for our fall schedule. We have Christina baker kleinand taylor Jenkins. Reid among many others, some of the hottest books ofthis summer. And we also have a lot of surprises planned along the way. Yeah.And we're super excited about our virtual Friends and fiction debut withthe Nantucket Book Festival. It is on july 20th at seven p.m. Eastern. Ourdiscussion is free and open to the public but you have to register so youcan find the information to sign up on the Nantucket Book Festival website andwe'll have information on our facebook page. Our good pal at Nantucket BookPartners tim Ehrenberg is going to turn the tables on us, putting us not see asthe guests. So now we are reaching the end, but if you know kristen you knowthat no book launch would be complete without cocktails. So today wecocktails. So today we invited three guests to join us to give us their ownspin on the classic star cocktail, Get it the Forest Vanishing Stars, A Starcocktail which is an actual drink created in the late 19th century. It isa take on a classic Manhattan. The...

...original contained equal parts applebrandy and sweet Freimuth plus a few dashes of bitters and simple syrup anda lemon twist for garnish. Well, we gave that recipe and total freedom tothree friends who we trust with our lives or maybe just with our alcohol tosee what they would come up with. We have posted all three recipes on ourinstagram page. So you can tell us which one you like best to find us.Just search for Friends and fiction on instagram and you'll find it. If you'renew to instagram, you can even access it from your computer by typing ininstagram dot com backslash. Friends in fiction. But for now let's bring in ourguests following you out there. Know Brenda Gartner and lisa Harrison, thefearless leaders of our friends in fiction, official Book Club testBrienza with the mock tail are alcohol free option and lisa with the cocktail.So welcome ladies, nice to see you on our side. I'm good to be here. This has been suchan amazing ladies rocked the house. Yeah, we did it so memorable, justfabulous. So it's great to be here to help in a small way to celebrate. Thankyou so much. You're here. Are you drinking Brenda? Yes. Yeah. Right. Umand you know, we have one more, we could not resist adding just one morefriends and fiction friend to the mix, as we say, not only do we consider hera connoisseur of cocktails, but she also happens to be a storyteller ofstars and she is the popular author new york times, best selling author of thepopular Chicago star series, including her newest When Stars collide, whichcame out just last week. Let's give our Big Friends and fiction. Welcome toSusan Elizabeth phillips SCP you already with your detail, what a partyyou guys and for such a crummy book. I I have been telling everybody aboutForest Vanishing Start and you know there's a lot of conversation you'regiving about a very lofty conversation about the book. I just want to say itis a page turner, I could not put that book down, it's just a wonderful bookand it so deserves a toast. Well you care soprano sipper here and I gottasay your drink looks really good question, there's no alcohol in itright now. It's kind of a fake drink, but very good. You know, you have totell us quickly about a plot of when stars collide any book right now thathas stars in the title. We're all in favour of. This is uh Diva meets thequarterback, monday night football, um meets Mozart and we have a heroine whois an opera singer and a hero who is the backup quarterback to the Chicagostars. She's number one, he's number two, He's not happy about this. Neitheris she. Things are gonna get complicated. Uh is so good. I love thisbook so much Susan you and I'm going to, oh my gosh, it's uh you guys have toread it. It's uh it's just so absorbing and so well told and so fast paced andit's just the perfect when when opposites attract story. I loved it somuch Susan. It's such a triumph for you. It is a mutual society. I was gonna sayyou both have the camera and you both have the word stars in your title. Sothere's something going on here. Okay ladies, let's see what you've got.First up Brenda. Okay, since I'm gonna diet, no alcohol is allowed. Can youshare your ma cocktail recipe for an alcohol free cocktail? I'm taking notes.I would love to. And first of all this is the under the stars mock tail inhonor of the forest of an issue stars. And it's it's a pretty uh generouslyfrom the original recipe, but I did include for serving before apple juice,not brandy, blueberry juice, four tablespoons juice.So there's that aspect of it and glass for your stars with apple juice firstand then some granulated sugar. So we have I think we should all actually. I wishwe could reach out and just grab it. I...

...know it looks okay. Don't y'all are socreative. Just so impressive what you came up with. Okay, so some liquor in aglass. Exactly, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Competition. Okay. How about youlisa, what's your spin on the Star full bodied cocktail? Well, I wanted mine tokind of be a little nod to the original but a little more contemporary as well.So I have the stargazer in the stargazer. It's got brandy and somecherry juice and a teaspoon of bidders and an orange slice a little bit oforange juice. And you top it off with Prosecco. So you muddle the free aglass and then you add the ice. Then you pour the brandy and then you do alittle bit of orange juice, a little bit of wolf water. And you top it withProsecco and I'm telling you it's a little stronger than I remember. Butyou see I've only have barely made it halfway so it is delicious. Soundsamazing. Uh last but not least our sister in stars. Susan Elizabethphillips. What's in your drink? Well because it's summer because I have asoprano. I wanted to make this the summer soprano sipper. I sort of madeup the quantity so to hydrate a couple of cups of seeded watermelon and youblend it and I think that's better than doing the watermelon juice and a half acup of chilled vodka which is I confessed is not actually in here rightnow, two tablespoons of lime juice or maybe one if you don't want it quitethat honey or simple syrup. I don't even know if you're gonna need it. Itdepends on how you want it. But you have to have the mint on top and to sueyour passion. You need some ice in it. I love that sounds really good. I haveto admit that sounds great, pushed up watermelon out vodka to really enjoy.Wow. Once again, all three of those recipes will be onour instagram which is at Friends and fiction or instagram dot com backslash.Friends and fiction and Susan. That drink like sounds as delicious as yournovel which which is very yes, yes, smoothly done. Well. Well thank youladies, all three of you for being here with us. That was so kind of you. I Iam thrilled that I got to celebrate the launch of the Forest Vanishing starswith the three of you. Dear Friends. So thank you for being here and thanks forsharing your cocktails. There was so much Amazing. Thank you. Season All right ladies. Okay, so before weplunge into song to close out our show, I wanted to say a true and deep thankyou to all four of you. My four friends and fiction sisters. I wanted to thankmeg and superstar. Sean behind the scenes, Christina and Stephen forcoming on and sharing your talents with us tonight, Brenda, lisa and Susan andall of you out there who have supported and embraced not only our books but us,we love you. We appreciate you more than you'll ever know. And we aredeeply, deeply grateful for you. We hope that week after week we give you areason to keep coming back for new, surprising and sometimes yes, evenbadly harmonized peeks behind the scenes at your favorite books and thelives of your favorite authors. But our night is over. I hope you buy my book.Thank you for being here. Thanks for taking a look your friends and fictionre reach this evening's and what we're here to. Thank you. Thanks for being afriend to all of you out there. You are the wind beneath our wings. You moveand inspire us and all created of things. Thank you and Goodnightwherever you are, we hope you will join us in the Forest, Vanishing Stars.Goodnight everyone. Please stick around...

...for the sip and stay with story pointafter show. Good night everyone. Good night. Oh my gosh! We lost Christie. It wasamazing. You guys, we did a musical. That was uh was beautiful. I was so offall night because I was so emotional after listening to them. That was thatwas absolutely crazy. But sorry, I'm getting off on the wrong foot welcomefor eight points. Sit and stay after show. We promise we will not be singinganymore unless crazes of my new book, flat christian tonight. So I'm sure forafter show, okay, you're a real christian so much when she starts todisintegrate, just shooting, she just made a little flat and two dimensionaltonight. I have it every night that I'm like, I just really can't with like thehair tonight. I can just double christians. Right, Well, I hopeeverybody out there has been seeing our uncorking the weekend videos. You don'twant to miss them on instagram and our facebook page and we are lifting ourstory, Point wine, whichever one we choose and maybe one of y'all tokristen and to summer because with the wind that says indulgence stories told,which is what we did all night. It is the wine we want and what an amazingstory Kristen told tonight in a musical. Why doesn't get to be that talented? Iknow my gosh, I was not the talent tonight. Those oh my gosh, shine itwell. Yes, you see it was just a recurring melody again and again thatthey capitalized on and made something stuck in. You know, for me, I wassurprised by my, by my reaction to be totally honest with you. I knew it wasa powerful story. I read the novel, but as I heard Christina seeing the lyrics,I got, I got teary eyed, I really did. And then along comes alexander and thenwhen, frankly when Sean Zeus came out, I was like, he did such a good job thatthe whole story seemed so real. It just didn't seem like reading a script. Itwas really beautiful. I felt like I could see that on a stage. Yeah,absolutely. I think I could feel it unfolding. I could see her I guessbecause we've read the book which all of you should be doing. But I feel likeI could watch her as this young baby being stolen and then in the woods andthen meeting these men. Like the musical was so evocative. I could, itwas like I could watch it. Come on, come on a stage. I have one questionWhat part does Liev Schreiber play in this screen in this movie that we'remaking? And I think he has. Yeah, he's got to return to the forest. That'sright. He was in defiance. He might as well be in this. You're absolutelyright. Yes. Can paul Ryan have apart. All right. My my I don't have a part. How about how about Patrick Dempsey?Can we squeeze a Patrick Dempsey? I don't know him like, you know, prettyNo, he can, he can grow out his hair and do the scruffy beard. I think hecould pull it off and James taylor being it Christie you're chanceboyfriend. Taylor bang your boyfriend. James taylor being it in allseriousness, in all seriousness because the stage is, is the forest and Ireally do almost like a play. I actually do see it could be a realmusical. That would be amazing. Any hey from your lips, let's, let's hopeReally cool. Yeah, about com fourth can we find a place for calling? Always.Always. I don't know how he sings. Have you? It doesn't matter how you use itmight matter a little bit. No, he can cause an amazing singer is Hugh Jackmantom and I saw him, Yeah, I actually, I saw him in Oklahoma On the West End inLondon when Katie was like 16 years old and it was yeah, he can really seegirls binoculars looking at Hugh Jackman. I'd never heard of him before.But wow, I passed him as Zeus in a heartbeat, lets you know how thishappened. I would add the line. All right. All right. All right. And therewere no not in this one. I know he can...

...have a quick walk on and walk off. Hecould just walk across the stage. Alright, alright, Daniel craig. Father,dan quickly Daniel craig was in the movie. Right? So he could be the germanfather. He was in the movie defiance. He said Aaron Bielskis older olderbrother Tuvia, He's getting older now. It's such a movie. Yeah, yeah. Everyoneshould watch that movie though. But you guys. I was off my game tonight becauseI was just so I don't think so. I am the least. I felt like I was havinglike an out of body experience, Do you know what I mean? Like it was one ofthose things like, oh my gosh, yeah, we're doing this. You know, the partthat I loved was when you were talking about how you didn't know when youbegan writing the book that you had all this history in Poland. Yeah, I lovethat. You know, because I just don't know. I didn't prior, I didn't for along time. No, a whole lot about my dad's family background. Uh, But my daddidn't really grow up with religion, so that wasn't passed on to me from hisside. I, what I got was the religion from my mom's side, which was Catholic.And so that's what I grew up with and that's what I grew up identifying with.And the last um, 20 years have really been a discovery of this piece of mygenetic history, a piece of my past, a piece of my family that I didn't knowthat much about before. So, um it's a journey I never intended to be on, butI'm so glad that I am and this, this felt like an important piece of that,you know, Kristen a lot of people, including my father's family, when theycame from Germany, they converted to Catholicism. And it turns out that alot of people who were fleeing and they were jewish converted as a way is totry to hide them hide their, that did happen. But on my dad's side of thefamily, they came over and that was not the case. You know, it's funny, likeyou can see on ancestry dot com, you can see all those old census recordsand all that, and you can see my grandmother, Rosie or great greatgrandmother Rosie, who I mentioned on all of the census forms. Her primarylanguage is listed as Yiddish. So even after she came over and had been herefor 10 2030 years, that was still the language that she felt most comfortablewith. Enough to put on her. I believe in genetic DNA. They settled rightKathy us where they settled right near Ron block and chiyo, chiyo. No kidding.Huh? Isn't that crazy money? Eastern europe force of Ohio. Yeah. So manyeastern Europeans settled in what we now call the Rust belt. Ohiopennsylvania. My husband's uh parents, his his family on both sides, on hismother's side the Croatian and on his father's side were yugoslavian. And souh they were people when they came over there were people who had already movedthere and they had jobs in the coke works and the steel mills in um WesternP. A. And then you know also into Ohio and indiana and uh you know I thinkthat's that's always been kind of the pattern. The earlier earlier immigrantscome, they settle and they weren't back home. There's jobs here and we speakyour language. The other things, I don't know if it's still true today. Iknow when I was there that there was a larger the second largest populationoutside of Warsaw for polish was Chicago. Oh yeah yeah yeah yeah you'regoing to say um Cleveland but yeah Chicago Chicago. Yeah yeah absolutely96 Olympics. Um you know I live in Atlanta but I live in a small towninside the beltline in Atlanta. And the Polish delegation to the Olympics wereheadquartered in our little town Avendano. And let me tell you thosepolls can part a, they can part a, you know, so my background is part polishpart irish. So you know that's a combination. I'm just saying you don'tmake sense now, a little bit of french, which gives me a little class and thenit just means you can drink a lot of champagne and whiskey. Yeah, you've gota wide variety there, you know, Kristen are you going back, where are you goingfor the next book? Back to France? Um so my um you knowjust sorry, I don't mean to make this all about like my my extensive familyhistory, but it turned out you know, I lived in paris um in my early twentiesand I found out afterwards I should really do all of my family history now.So I know in the future before I start doing things before you write a book.Um but when I lived I lived in paris...

...and it turns out Later I found out thatmy great grandmother, my grandmother's mother um had lived just a few blocksaway from me in Paris. So um I have that, I think I feel Paris and my bloodtoo, but Paris is the place I'm very comfortable with because I've lived,there is a place I've written about several times. And yeah the next one's,World War II Paris, but also in 1950s New York. Well when you get back canyou go back, can you go to France this time? Do you think? I hope so. I'mreally hopeful that I'll be able to, I'll meet you there. Okay. I think weneed a group trip. I like it. We have to last summer that was cancelledbecause of the pandemic. And so we still have our chicken. So. Oh, to MeetYou there sounds good. One of my fit, there were so many favorite parts, butone of my favorite parts tonight was when Sean busted out singing. I got alittle like I love that song, I'm downloading it to tomorrow, but justthe musical words to you know, he's works, he's incredible and he worked sohard with us, but he's always behind the scenes and to hear him just bustout singing was really lucky. We're how lucky were we to just randomly? I know,I mean Christie, Christie. Yeah, well Sean probably doesn't even remember it,but we just had a really funny day and I was like when we I mean it's likemonths later that we decided to do this and I was like, oh yeah, that guy,that's the guy I that's all you left out and somebody with a sense of humor,all these guys is happening kind of looks And that basically sums up thelast 15 months. I know, I know, but you know what? He fits with us perfectly,like he fits with us. Like he was meant to be with, I mean, you know what Imean? Like I can't really imagine friends in fiction without him. Youknow what I mean? Like he's just seriously imagine him and meg's facesbehind the scenes. I can we've known them. So now I can imagine their faceslike, can I cut that is why, you know, speaking of Sean in all seriousness,when can we download his song friday, this friday y'all? You're still herelistening to his check this friday y'all. It's okay. I love you. Maybe canwe put a link um to the song on the beach? We have to um there's a link upor there's a post up under announcements right now. That links tothat contest we mentioned for the four signed books. It also talks aboutChristina and where you can follow her. And it also talks about Sean and whereyou can find him. That's all in that one single post. And then, and then Ialready have it scheduled to post on friday. Um to where we can find Seansingle because it is out on friday and I want everybody to be able to find it.So that is already, it's loaded and ready to go eight a.m. Friday morning.Can we make maybe do you summer? Do you think you can make Sean chart? But you did not begin charting? We wantto hear that song for us and I think I think I didn't want to say anything.But yeah, he's made a horrible loving wife, the mother of his two youngadorable Children. But he wouldn't say maybe to her that I love you for sure.I think maybe the baby's depending definitely hey hey sean that could bethe one that could be the B side on your cabana boy. Exactly. I'm sorry forthe dog panting follow up song to um um uh what's the song? Um You better shoparound. There's a bunch of old sixties records and there's a follow up song toit. Like there's one that's mama mama told me you better shop around and thenthere's uh is like I shopped around and then there's the oh I didn't know that.Yeah. And then uh you know the song about um it's my party Lesley gore.Yeah. Party uh Oh god. We know uh huh song, the follow up to that song isit's the revenge song which is, it's judy's turn to cry. I I did not knowthat. Oh no...

...cry cry cry. I I was just thinking about how I wasgoing to wear these crowns to my birthday party. That was a veryappropriate song to break up. I think I'm going to wear this crown all thetime. Oh my God my God. Alright scratch meg meg helpfully is sayingdon't quit your day jobs. Thanks meg Meg. I should pop on before we say good nightwith your, come on, bring them on. We could nothave done this tonight without you guys. Thank you. Meg is refusing to turn hercamera. You'll always be Zeus she you know sheturned it on because she got her hair did today looks good to help. So shecame on. You got awesome. It was a great show launch, this was so manyworking, so much fun and all the good stuff. Sean did you, are you happy? Areyou happy with the way with? Yeah, I was remarkably uh stressed out aboutthis. I don't know why. I'm just thinking in front of my computer. You,you were stupid. You guys are so sweet and you know the love goes both ways.God this was meant to be. I I love this way. Maybe way maybe the way I feellike I have to say that song was inspired by my four year old. So wait,maybe, Oh no, he falls in love with every attractive woman on tv. Every a okay does all the time to every timeI'm with her she's watching a movie, I'm going to marry him. A thank you. I thank you Everybody findyour tour and everything so people can find it for the rest of the asking.Just my website, Christine, Harmel dot com. I have a combination um live andvirtual tour so if you can't make it to one of the live events, there areplenty of virtual ones and I'm doing a virtual when on friday with Christie soum and with Christie and also run blocks so that's probably probablyphone a never get, I'm like I'm like round Kristen whodoes age just a family. A lot of fun. Yeah and onTuesday I'm going to be with Mary Kay live live and in person in Atlanta atFox Hill, Tuesday night at 6:30 and then I'm going to be with Mary Alice,the following Friday I think Friday. And you know what? We're making itpublic while opening it up for a while so we're gonna make it public and thenthe following sunday with mary Kay and patty in Tybee Island. So it's going tobe everywhere, everywhere, everywhere, everywhere. Alright, this was a thankyou guys. Thank you guys so much time. I have a musical for you guys. I mean honestly he gives and she gives bravo,bravo, bravo. It was better than I anticipated. Great. Thank you. I a guys,that's our instagram guru. Hey Grace, I it's going to collapse. I love youguys so much. You guys. I thank you for tuning in, Join us every week onFacebook or YouTube where our live show airs every Wednesday night at sevenp.m. eastern time and please subscribe to our podcast and follow us oninstagram. We're so glad you're here. Yeah.

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