Friends & Fiction
Friends & Fiction

Episode · 1 year ago

Friends & Fiction with Taylor Jenkins Reid

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Meet New York Times bestselling author, Taylor Jenkins Reid, whose books have been chosen by Reese’s Book Club, Read with Jenna, Indie Next, Best of Amazon, and Book of the Month. Taylor is the author of seven novels, including DAISY JONES AND THE SIX, which is currently being adapted by Hello Sunshine into a limited series for Amazon. She joins us to discuss her most recent book, the instant New York Times bestseller and Read with Jenna pick, MALIBU RISING, which is in development with Hulu for a limited series. https://taylorjenkinsreid.com/

Welcome to Friends and fiction. five best selling authors and the stories. Novelist Mary Kay Andrews, Christine Harmel, Christie Woodson Harvey Patty Callahan, Henry and Mary Alice Munro are five longtime friends with more than 80 published books to their credit In 2020 they created friends and fiction to provide author interviews and fascinating insider talk about publishing and writing and to highlight independent bookstores. These friends discuss the books, they've written the books they're reading now and the art of storytelling. If you love books and you're curious about the writing world you're in the right place. Hi everyone welcome with so much to look forward to tonight. I am to see what's in Harvey and I will be your host. I'm mary. Kay Andrews. Remember me, I'm Kristin Harville, she's gone one week. She thinks we could possibly forget her. I am jordie Callahan and this is Friends and fiction, new york times, bestselling authors, homeless stories to support independent bookstores tonight you'll be taylor Jenkins. Reid were so excited. Um and we will talk about her gorgeous new book Malibu rising which released on june 1st and was hands down one of my favorite books of the year and also in our continuing support of indie booksellers tonight. Our bookstore of the week is book soup located in good old los Angeles California. We will tell me telling you a little bit more about that in just a little while and we have a partner tonight that we want to thank so much, Caroline's cakes this month. The five of us are taking a bite out of summer with Caroline's cakes all month long will be telling you about our beach bag. Must have favorite reads of the summer are ideal Labor Day weekend and our favorite Caroline's cake bite flavor on our individual facebook and on our instagram. So make sure you're following all of us and we are offering you the chance to win the ultimate Labor Day weekend beach bag brimming with swag swag swag swag swag swag and Caroline's information is under announcements on our facebook page and some of you might know that the other ladies of the fab five call me peach and to explain that it's not because I'm so peachy. It's because my initials are P. C. H. And so I have to tell you that it is actually national peach month. So all month long the ladies are going to send me gifts. I don't know I listed memo about that. Okay, just went You Miss one Week and then you don't get the memo last week we all voted that you were going to send them all mary. Kay, that's that's the plan. Not long peach gift. Anyway, they have, they have a decadent peach delight cake. So I just thought I'd let you know that I mean and you already know that we partner with Parade magazine every single week online. We stream from their facebook page for our show and we have an original essay in their online magazine every week. This week mary Kay wrote a really beautiful one about how everyone has a story of their own called what dream do you have? You can find it linked on our facebook page and then our instagram bio. But meanwhile mary Kay, can you tell us a little bit about it? Yeah I was inspired to write the essay after I was after I read the new york times profile about olympic gymnast um Simone biles. You know her story started with a mother struggling with addiction issues and she was she and her younger sister were in and out of foster care until her grandfather stepped in and adopted the two of them, wow now that story could have had a really different ending and that sort of started me thinking about examining a crossroads in my career in my life and how taking control of my ambitions changed my outcome. And um you know the thing is I think I think maybe as women sometimes we feel like we don't control our own narrative. And so I wonder early there was a time in your life story where you just had to grab the wheel. Yeah. You know that's interesting that you say that about women feeling like you can't control your own narrative and I think that's one of the best lessons you can learn as an adult as an adult woman and and for me I think the moment was making the switch from writing romantic...

...comedy to writing historical fiction, which is not what I was being told I should do. It was not what I was being told I could do. Um and I thought, but that's where my heart is and that's what I need to try to do. Um and I think summoning that courage to chart my own path and yes, I did say chart ladies. I wasn't going to say a word summoning that. It's like all I mixed it. It just went, I'm naughty summoning that courage I think made a big difference in my life. So I could probably have the same answer as both of you if I guess what you're gonna say. But I thought I'd just be a little different because this might sound silly to some people but um deciding to move to Beaufort to move to the beat. It doesn't seem like that big of a deal, but there were like a million reasons that we shouldn't and there were a lot of people who told us we couldn't do that and we couldn't live there and that wasn't okay. And it was like, it felt like a really, really big step in a huge decision to be like, you know, actually why why can't we, what if we what if we could and um and it's been great. I'm so glad we did it. That's awesome. I mean mary Kay, when I read, you know, I texted you after I finished reading it, I just thought it was such a beautiful essay and I felt like and you put a little list at the bottom and I printed it because it's really really I mean we talk all the time but it just was this really great. It kind of hit the right notes but there's it has something to do with agency right like with taking agency of our own life and saying you do not get to define me And I mean most people here know I was a pediatric nurse before I started writing and when I met Mary Kay Andrews at a Christmas Party, a company Christmas Party Gosh it's probably been 25 years I was afraid to say I'm writing a book. I pulled her aside and whispered like like I was asking for a porn channel will you will you go out to lunch with me and talk about writing and I feel like the similarly of the night goes to patty, I probably should have thought about that before I said it but anyway it's just but you do you feel like it's it's embarrassing to say I want to take agency of my own life and do this new thing that nobody I know is doing and brave enough to whisper it to somebody else and then you just kind of go from there. So reading that essay, made me remember that mary Kay thank you So true patty, I'll not talk about that anymore you know I'm so the last person that has the porn channel, but I really want to hear what taylor has to say about that and you know, we love, you know, I mean maybe I don't I don't know, we just got but you know, we love sharing with all of you, we love sharing our big news with you first and we have, we've got a little something, I just spit on myself. Well, you know, we do have something cool to share with you tonight and I think that was the perfect segue, not the spit part, but yeah, we were talking about earlier because we're talking about making courageous leaps into something A little bit knew a little bit of an unexpected direction. So without further ado we are so excited to share with you the brand new cover of Christie's March 29 2020 to release the wedding veil. Isn't it beautiful? We're always spoiled because we always get to see it first, but we never lose our reaction were like, you know, they've seen Every all 277 iterations of the wedding clear winner winner Christie Christie. Do you want to tell oh sorry, you asked if you wanted to tell us about, tell us about the wedding veil. I want to hear about it. Not just okay, super quickly, I'm so excited about this book. Um so Edith Vanderbilt, who was the first mistress of biltmore state which you can see in the background there, um had this really almost kind of mythic family wedding veil that was worn by her grandmother, her mother, her sisters, her daughter cornelia and then it disappeared so fast forward about 100 years and um fictional Julia Baxter is standing in the back of the church in the bridal room getting ready, her grandmother is getting ready to put her wedding veil on her head and um it all of a sudden hits her that her her marriage isn't gonna last and then she's going to be the one to sully the magic of her family wedding veil. And...

...so um we get to follow these four women from these very different time periods who are facing um some really similar situations but in very different time periods um and this each of their wedding veils kind of becomes this um this symbol of something that they have to let go of in order to move forward in their lives. And of course we get to find out my version, of course of what happens to the real life Vanderbilt bail. I'm really excited. Oh and I was gonna tell you guys um I am doing a fun little preorder freebie that I know we do sometimes. Um and so if you pre order there is a there should be a post on facebook shortly. Um you get this really pretty the wedding veil rosebud tea and a book plate and a bookmark. And yeah, so preorder sign up anyway, I can't wait to share it with you. I'm so excited. Really? Okay, so now let's talk about our incredible guests. Taylor Jenkins relate the new york times best selling author of seven novels, including Mallaby Rising daisy jones in the six and the seven husbands of Evelyn Hugo. Um she's kind of a slacker nothing. Her books have been selected by Reece's Book Club and that's Reese Witherspoon Read with uh in the next Thanks for clarifying that you might not know, I don't know some people live in Gates, what do you want? Anyway? Uh, in the next deaths of amazon. Book them up and they've been featured in people quickly, Entertainment weekly and car and driver. I'm like, Lord I seen your own admission to make sure we don't forget you again. Is that what this is? Yeah, she's staking her claim, I'm back. Alright, so for Taylor's novel Daisy jones in the sixth, she wrote not only the novel, but also the lyrics for each song, which is so cool. The novel was named one of the best books of 2019 by NPR the Washington. Post car and driver kidding about that and many other media outlets. Although I'm sure if car and driver had a book pick this would be it. It is currently being adapted into a limited tv series for amazon by Hello Sunshine. It's also right. Reese Witherspoon's company starring Riley Keogh who of course is Elvis's granddaughter, Which seems very very it was when they were talking about you know when she sold the rights and they were talking about casting the movie I was like please don't mess up daisy, please don't matter. A great pick. So taylor lives in Los Angeles with her husband and her five year old daughter and her new book Malibu Rising came out in june and was a read with Janna Book Club pick. It is also set to be adapted into a series for you. The novel follows the four famous Riva siblings through one Eventful nights one party in the summer of 1983. Yeah sounds like Spring break anyway during their annual end of summer party secrets are revealed and over the span of just a few hours lives are changed forever. Yeah. Amazing. All right well sean let's bring taylor on. Hi thank you. See here thank you for coming. Welcome. We're so excited to be here. We're so excited for you. You have not one but two books on the new york times best seller list for The 10th Week. The Mallaby Rising Spin On yeah 10 weeks today. Yeah and then the seven husbands of Evelyn Hugo is on paperback and combined. Right. Yes so Exactly. Well before we get started could you tell us just a little bit about Malibu rising. Yeah I would love to um Malin rising is the story of the read family and they are four siblings um living in Malibu in the early 80s, there all surfers. Nina the oldest is a supermodel and J Is like a championship surfer and hugs the surf photographer and kit is like the bold risky one who's maybe the most talented of them all and they're throwing a rager at the end of the summer in 1983. Um And malvo rising is the story of that day. So you go through the day with them hour by hour going into the party to see this wild night unfold because you know that by the end of it somehow somewhere somebody set the fire and the whole thing ends in flames. Well it was truly incredible. Um and I read in an interview that you did that...

...your favorite quote as everyone wants to be Cary Grant even Cary Grant, which was said by Cary Grant and you said I think that's the very essence of what I've been writing about for three bucks now. And when I read that I was like yes, like it just hit me like in the exact right spot. So if someone who has devoured and loved your last three books, like I really feel that quote for these books but can for those people who maybe haven't read all of your books yet, can you? Or those three books, can you tell us what you meant by that? Yeah. Yeah. Well so so when I was a kid I was really, really obsessed with Hollywood and it was it was on two levels. It was I was really obsessed with movies or a tv and then I was also really obsessed with the people that made them the actors, writers directors, what's the story behind the story that I'm learning? And when I came across that quote when I was a teenager and I was really I went through a really intense Cary Grant phase where I liked everything that he was in and I just still to this day, I just endlessly charmed by him. And so I came across that quote and what I realized is whatever this fiction is that were being sold, whether it's the story or even what we're told is the behind the scenes true, it's all manufactured, it's not real. Even Cary Grant who is the most debonair, dashing, charming romantic hero, Even Cary Grant doesn't feel like Cary Grant, it doesn't exist. Yeah, that broke a lot of things open for me, you know, when I was a teenager it was more like isn't this the most clever quote you've ever heard? You know? And I would tell everybody my best friend at the time was like I get everybody wants to be Cary Grant Grant, Cary Grant, you know, and like you I was just really obsessed with it. And then later on when I started writing about famous people, I realized I was kept keep coming back to that same thing, but there's a difference between what you're being sold and what's actually happening and that happens in a tension between those two things is what my work is about. I love it. So yeah, that's so well said, so how do you balance that? You know, you have these really glittering worlds, but you're also revealing this kind of deep, dark underbelly of, you know, some of the most idealized things that you know, we can think of rock stars, movie stars, models, famous surfers. So how do you balance, because I still feel like in these stories, even though, you know that deep dark underbelly, you still leave with the sense of this kind of there's still a little bit of glitter, you know, to be had in these worlds for sure and you balance that so well. So can you talk about that? Thank you? I think really what it is that I like the glitter just as much as I look through, you know, and if you're not gonna if you're not going to indulge in the glitter, then why are we here? Why are we in Hollywood? Why are we on the Sunset strip? Why are we on the beach? Um yeah, tomatoes, you know, like, you know, I wanted to be fun and I want you to be able to feel those moments where where like everything sort of shines because what's fun to me is the difference and the um the juxtaposition of those two things, Everything looks really glittery and shiny and everybody's rich and beautiful are their lives better than our Yeah, probably not. Everybody has problems and so I like, I think what it is is trying to tell the truth as close as I can get to it and the truth is that it is both cd and glamorous, you know, Seventies Rock is really super cool and also there is a sadness in it. There being a rock star is probably super fun and at the same time, really chaotic hard job. And so I think the truth is that there is a balance of those things and I'm trying to get there as close as I can. Yeah, well you do an amazing job. I mean daisy jones in the six, you know, one minute you're wishing you or her and the next minute you're like, oh thank God, I don't have to do such an incredible job of the and both with that. Instead of the either or so you kudos as a high school greek mythology geek. I love that you have said I returned to myth, the retelling of tales as old as time. How do you think that the reading and the learning of these stories has influenced you...

...mythology in general has influenced you as a writer in particular with Malibu rising, which does feel mythic in a lot of ways. And so does daisy jones in the six? It's very much a mythic tale of rock and roll. So how has mythology affected your storytelling? I love that question, I think, you know, for me, and it's been a process of learning this throughout the seven books that I've published now, is that you have stories that that can be really good stories and then stories that sort of transcend Jessica book that they're in, they become larger than just that moment. And for me, you know, the most obvious place that we go to for that is are these myths that we keep telling in our society over and over and over. Um when, you know, Phoebe Waller Bridge says this really great thing about like you have to go greek in order to really get into the real meat of something, you know, what is the tragedy that we're exploring at any given time? And I think um what I realized that it's funny because what what led me to it was more um not technically meant, but The Great Gatsby is a book that I think transcends the story, the characters, Daisy Buchanan isn't just a character, he is an archetype for a type of person. You know, jay Gatsby is not just one person, he's specific, but it's also the the the specific person becoming universal, he is the embodiment of a dream that will not die. And so how do you make a character who isn't just in that specific story, but becomes, becomes representative of something much larger and myth teaches us how to do that. And so with Evelyn Hugo with daisy jones with nina riva. It's a question of, you know, what about them? Can I create that? At least for me feels big and bigger than just this moment that we're learning about them in the story. I think the word archetype just nails it on the head. So if you can, when you take nina or you take jay's daisy, they are an archetype of a very specific kind of person and then you give them such detailed peculiarities that they daisy. I can see in my mind right and same with Nina, but they're also representative. So so I really love that. And in Mallaby rising surfing feels symbolic too. And almost religious like a religious experience I've never served because my sense of balance is about as good as a toddler. So, so why surfing, what does it mean to you? I can tell you've done it. There's no way you could describe it that way without having been on a board. So what does it mean to you? And the riva family Patty. I might have, I might have fooled you a bit there. I wow, I've been on a board for about 20 minutes in Hawaii on vacation and it was embarrassing. Okay, I feel so much better. I am shocked by that because I was like this woman is a surfer. Yes, so I like to, I like to pretend and, and so I learned a lot about it and then I pretended for a while it's really, it was really fun to do. I think here's the thing about surfing that I came to appreciate talking to surfers, learning about surfing and also as just someone that loves the water. Um it's one of the only sports that I can think of that requires you have a relationship to mother nature, you cannot serve if the water is not good for surfing and you, you think, I don't really feel like surfing today, you could miss an incredible once in a lifetime weight. That is, you know, that's just not the same if somebody's playing soccer, somebody's playing tennis or somebody's playing football. Those are, and own a different type of reward structure. But you have to have a relationship with the ocean and you have to have a respect for the ocean in order to surf. And I think that's a really, really beautiful thing when you talk to surfers, People that get up, you know early in the morning to get out there. They get, especially we're talking about California, surface specific ocean is very cold. You know, you're getting up, you're going into...

...the cold, cold water, you're putting on a wet suit, you're doing it because you love the ocean, you love to serve and that chance that you might just find the perfect wave and write it perfectly. Um that's a thing that does require some level of chance. Said can easily become spiritual and religious. This ocean. You know, this wave was given to me. Uh, and I felt that way, just really, really fascinating. No wave. You know, like I was watching this documentary about kelly slater and he has a picture of this like perfect wave that he did not. Yeah, and it's like this is the wave that he went away. Yeah. Well you know the number one name in surfing, this is the guy like that, that is known to be a phenomenal surfer. And even for him, there's that wave that alludes you and I think it's, that makes it, it's a short, but it's an adventure. It's uh, it's a given tape. I just find that really, really fascinating. Yeah, that's a great example of world building. Yeah. Because you don't, I mean so many of us, we create these worlds that we don't actually in real life know anything about or have any talent for, um, you know, taylor beneath the shimmering facade of the world you created in Malibu rising. There's a very real and very painful family past, the twists and turns and it affects each of the siblings present lives in a real way. Menina falls into fame, not because she wants to or is seeking it because she yet, but because she has to support her siblings and her entire life is then dictated by her devotion to her family. And she's such a fascinating character. I loved how the outer world defined her by her beauty. But she never really took much stock in it and the rest of it. The lens she sees her life through revolves around how she's able to manage the happiness of her siblings and me, you know, more than any other person. I think she must be the true embodiment of the Hollywood persona. That is one person publicly. And then somebody completely different inside. And I wondered what if there was anybody who inspired her character and you know, we're seeing questions popping up from viewers wanting to know is it Stevie Nicks? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, it's funny with every book, there's always somebody that you can point to that, that it seems like I'm writing about, right, so days it seems like it's about Stevie Nicks or seven husbands Evelyn Hugo. Especially for people that haven't read. It seems like it's about Liz taylor. Um you know, for for this, I think Nina Reva comes closest to somebody like Brooke shields, somebody in the public eye, you know, who's image was sort of controlled for them and sexualized for them, especially by a stage mom. Yeah. And and oddly enough, and I swear to do this on purpose because they didn't Brooke shields did not occur to me until many drafts later. But Brooke Shields and went on to marry a tennis star parallels there. But uh, I really try very hard to make sure that if I'm inspired by somebody and the most direct inspiration for any of these books was my love of Stevie Nicks, wanting to write something, you know, in that vein, Well, I just have this thing where I feel like I don't want to use an actual person's life, I try to make sure nothing that happens in daisy jones happen to Stevie Nicks really? Or like, you know, there's there are things that you can read and you'll say, oh maybe this is Elizabeth taylor and Evelyn Hugo, but there's a lot of stuff about Evelyn Hugo that's very different than Elizabeth taylor. And so same with Brooke shields for this one, there's there's a sense and you see that they maybe would occupy the same space within, you know, I had a promotional culture and Brooke shields are real culture, but then how do they, how do they differ from there? And so did a lot of research about Brooke shields and I found her just really, really fascinating and some of the things that nina goes through in terms of the way that she's seen in the way that she is treated by the men around her, um was was not dissimilar to Brooke shields, Calvin klein campaign back on it. I got, it goes back to the point at which Brooke Shields decided to take over her own narrative. Absolutely right. You know, people are also and fascinated with mitt riva, the shadowy presence in...

...their lives. Always gone, but always there. Yeah. Um, did you set out to make Mick a foil for Nina two? I well or is he one? Yeah. I mean, look, Nick has been now in three of my books. He mentioned very briefly in daisy jones, but he he shows up for the first time in Evelyn Hugo. And really, to be honest, he came to me as a foil for Evelyn Hugo. If this was especially he is her third husband. The scene he really does occupies one chapter. And uh, funny, I don't remember that. Like I love that book so much, but I didn't, I didn't, I didn't put that together. So I've got to go back and like look at that. So, so he he is the husband that Evelyn mary's in Vegas. And um, he serves a very specific purpose in that story. And a big part of that purpose was, you know, somebody who thinks that they have that they're one step ahead of Evelyn, but nobody's ever a step ahead of Evelyn. Evelyn is always in charge. And so I really enjoyed writing him. Um, as someone who, you know, was going to sort of get his come up and it's a little bit. And so I then in daisy jones. I had this scene where I wanted to put somebody who had been in one in Evelyn Hugo in the book and I had this opportunity to put him in a scene where he just seemed like a real pad and I thought, well that works. And then, and then, and then what I realized with Malibu rising is that I wanted to write a story about the Children of famous people when that lens is not, it's not something that you chose. It's something that was for you. Absolutely. And I wanted to write about Children who had to raise themselves because their parents weren't there. And so you basically comes down to like, okay, who's the famous man? He's going to leave his kids that you had. Yeah, yeah. Already know. But what was nice, what was a nice opportunity for me to explore was that um, nick riva is a man and, and I had a lot of fun writing him because he's the sort of man who in our society, handsome, white charming, talented men are often able to get away with so much. We will excuse their behavior time and time again if we can, we will sometimes trip over ourselves like, oh well you understand. Like, I don't think he really meant that, you know, he was messed up on drugs. He went into rehab right after that. Yeah. I mean if they're handsome enough and talented enough and charming, you know, and they're a man especially right, he will excuse it all. And so what I wanted to think about was it's not, it's not necessarily that man that I'm as interested in, but if this is a guy who will just blow off anything and let the chips fall where they may and and devil may care, there's probably a woman behind him cleaning it all up and the person who who has to do the work that Mick Reba is not bothering to do, so he's one of these kids and then he's going to get bored of being, you know, a conventional dad, he's gonna take off who are the women left behind raising those Children and that becomes the story of mine Areva. And so that the story really took shape for me at that moment, show me the woman who's cleaning up the messes. Yeah. And let's see what that life is like and let's see if there's a mess that is just so vast that she will finally say no. Yeah, yeah. Gosh, I found that that's so interesting about Nina, but you know, I felt like her mother june was such an interesting, Deceptively complex character too because she was really the first one cleaning up the messes, right? And setting that precedent for it. Um so Taylor I wanted to just ask you a question about yourself, you moved to Hollywood at the age of 21, right? And before becoming a novelist you did stints and entertainment tech casting and even TV writing? How cool. I know how cool. Yeah, that's awesome. Can you talk a little bit about where you're from, what drew you to Hollywood and how you finally turn to writing about fame and Tinsel town. Yeah. You know, I am from acting massachusetts. I love massachusetts with my whole heart. I miss it dearly. I especially miss it now when it's so hot here in California.

I know, I'm like seeing that like Starbucks is like about to start their pumpkin spice latte uh areas like back home, it's gonna start to cool down soon and like you belong here and I think for my, my, you know, fall foliage, but you know, I just always, always knew, You know, you can, you can ask me an eight years old, 10 years old, 12 years old, it didn't matter what do you want to do when you grow up? I'm going to Hollywood, that was the thing. I knew what I wanted and it was, I was obsessed with Hollywood, film, television. I couldn't have told you what exactly I wanted to do, but I knew that that's what it was. So once a Film and television school in Boston, I came out here when I turned 21, I got a job in casting um and loved it. It was so fun and everything that I thought it would be and like, You know, I'm like, I'm 21 years old, I'm working my first job out of college, there's all these like stars from WP soap operas coming in? You know where it's like oh Scott's Beekman from Felicity's here. Yeah just walked in you know like I was in heaven I loved it but I don't know why I just remember coming into work morning after morning and I have this one was like I'm not where I'm supposed to be I'm calling it's not exactly right when it took me a while to figure it out and that's why I bounce from place to place. But eventually what I realized is I'm really really interested in storytelling and I'm really interested in character and that's why casting was very interesting to me but ultimately I want to make the characters I want to be that world. And so I tried my hand at writing film one surprise trying a little bit of T. V. And then I was like you know I would I mean I just loved books and so I gave that a shot and that was like you know it's not unlike when you meet the love of your life. Like if I met my husband and halfway through our first date I was like I've known you for years and that's what writing books that that's what it was for me. It was like here it is this is the thing I was meant to do and it took me a little while to piece together that I could write books about how much I love Hollywood and how long things came together. I really feel like I'm in the space of my career where I can I can just say definitively from from the purest place in my heart, I'm doing what I love and I'm writing the books that I want to see on the shelf and it's just such a lovely feeling, you know, God, I love that so much. And I'm so interested though, how you're perspective has shifted because you write about fame, you write about Hollywood, you write about as we were talking about earlier, the Glamour on one side, but kind of the seedy underbelly of it on the other side. The dark side to it when you started off doing that though, you didn't you didn't have a name yet, right? Like, you you were you were breaking into the business, you were looking at it from kind of the outside now in the last couple of years, I feel like your career has exploded. And as a novelist, you've really become a household name, you've achieved that level of novelist fame, has that changed the way you look at the subject matter you're writing about now, you have a little bit, or a lot of that fame that you're writing about and you're a little bit more on the inside of seeing that picture than you were before. Yeah, I mean it's not too similar, I guess to like when you start out as a rapper who's like on the hood and then and then suddenly you're and it's not, you know, it's like, I'm like, Bruce Springsteen writing about being the factory and then it's like, you know, Spring Springsteen is not a factor anymore. I mean, I mean, look, there's certainly elements of my life where I'm seeing some of the things that I have written about because I'm a public facing person. I feel really, really like, I immediately need to reject the idea that I'm in any way famous um because novelists just have such a different relationships to their readers that I think any traditional. Um but but I definitely look, I'm writing a book now and there are passages where I feel like I'm writing about, like, there was, I mean, I'm writing a book about a famous woman who's surprised and and I had the scene where she's like, not as nice as me, and she was like, I don't want to sign people's stuff and I don't understand why anyone needs my autograph or whatever. And then I was like, I hope you have a little think I'm saying that, you know, because, you know, my career is changing and um so look, there's some growing pains in that regard, but I am writing about people that I still...

...think are vastly vastly different from myself, people with massive audiences and and and they need to tell a story about their lives that I love running about, but personally, I could not do, I'm really, really bad at any kind of acting or insincerity. Um you get what you get with me and you know, it's like I'm just hanging out at home with my daughter trying to decide if I should go to Mcdonald's and that's kind of like who I am and I'm not able to pretend to be glamorous and so um there is some tension there, but in general, I think I I'm I'm much more boring than my project, so we we have live questions and people love timing in from the audience. So Alison Hammer, who's one of our favorite authors and a friend of ours, she just rode in and says that she absolutely loves how inventive your story structures are. I think we we agree, and she asked when you're working on a book, do you set out to do something that's never been done before, or this parts for me, or does it just naturally arise from the storytelling, it's really important to me that I not do something that I've done before, I'm not um so bold as to think that I've done anything that hasn't been done before. Um I I really am just trying to make sure I don't repeat myself, I'm challenging myself, I'm taking on something new, and also I'm trying to write a story that feels immersive I'm trying to feel a story that feels like it's putting you in it and so what is the structure that allows me to do that. Um and it may be a less conventional structure in order for me to put the reader there The way that I want to, so with Malibu rising, you know, it takes place over 24 hours. It's divided into each hour. Um, and the reason for that is that I want you to feel like you're, you have that feeling of like the day before the party and I feel like, oh, the party's starting, we've got to get dressed, you know, and like I want you to feel like, oh, the party's just started. There's not as many people here and then it's like, oh jeez, there's way too many people at this party, you know, like I want you to feel that and not just witnessed it from a distance. And so every time I'm starting a book, it's how do I serve the story best? And I'm totally open to that being something bonkers like, oh, an oral history of a fake famous man, like it takes. That's what I'm going to do that. All right, We have another question from Renee Carruth Minton, She says, I hear your next book will be set in the 90s. Can you tell us anything about it? I'm already excited for the next one. Well, I thank you, I love that. It is said in the 90s and it's about a famous woman as I was saying earlier and um, I look there's not much more I can say about it. But I will say this, I see Evelyn Hugo daisy jones Malval rising in this next one as a sort of quartet that they it goes together. These are my four stories about women living in the public eye. And there's a very specific type of woman that I have not written about yet. And I am really enjoying writing about. She's um you know, it's a it's a different sort of relationship with the public and I have had a lot of fun digging into it. Oh, we are so curious man out. Okay. I think we could all guess who she's writing about. Inspired by inspired by meg walker just said, yeah, no, here's what I think. And I wish, I thought, I mean, Martha Stewart, it's a good one. It she says that she looks away and drink up. It's obviously not, it's obviously not Martha Stewart guys, grass. Oh, Courtney, somebody's messing. Courtney love. That is a great guess. It is not Courtney love. There's no, there's no corollary. It's not pretty either. But God, I would love to write that book. Sorry, that's why I won't because Britney has shown me and taught me such a valuable lesson that I feel like I learned time and time again, which is that nobody owns Britney's storybook, Britney that is stories about themselves. And look, if Britney wants to tell her story, I will be first in line to buy it. I love Britney and I love Courtney love to and Courtney love...

...is um a really good guess. I would love to do a Courtney love story as well. But again, Courtney Love is very good at telling her own story. Yeah, good point. Yeah, that's true. Well, I wanted to ask something really quickly um that we just haven't quite gotten to yet, but I'm really fascinated by, we know you have to tv adaptations in the works. Um and we heard that daisy jones is in filming now. So can you tell us a little bit about the process of bringing the book to the screen and how involved have you been in that? Yeah, I mean it's my involvement depends on the project. So sometimes I'm really involved, sometimes I'm less involved and it also has to do with who I'm choosing to work with. What's incredible about daisy jones in particular is that, I mean, it's just like a dream. Um the teams that they put together for it is top notch and I chose the screenwriters in particular, scott new center Michael Weber because I am huge fans of theirs. And um and so that one was, I just handed it over and they've done a beautiful job, a beautiful job. I called that new starter after meeting the draft and I was like, I couldn't have asked for anything more. I really couldn't and it's a lovely, lovely feeling and so they were going to start shooting that soon. The cast is incredible. The music is so good. The scripts are great. I'm like I can't believe I just can't believe I'm pinching myself but like I think I think it's great. I think people are gonna love it. Um Malveaux Rising was a book that just took me so much longer to write. It has so many different pieces in it that um I've stayed on as an executive producer on that one and so I'm helping to shape the direction of that story but I have to tell you again, we found just the most incredible Writers. We have two women Liz Taylor and Amy Talking tonight. We really get the story, they get the character if they get what I'm trying to do. My first conversation with Amy talking to one was like two hours and we just couldn't stop talking about all the things that we had in common and that we wanted to wanted this project to talk about. So I get to be more involved in Malibu but to be honest I'm also not really needed Amy has got it job and she's putting together just an incredible first episode at the moment and you know we'll see how things unfold from there. That's great. Well we can't wait, I can't wait. I'm so excited. I know we all can't wait to watch them. So okay Yeah. I also can't wait. I'm very excited. Yeah sure. Our sean just asked if you needed a composer, Composer mary Kay, do you wanna take over what, what am I supposed to ask? Weird, we're really polished here. I just got here, you know, so I know what I'm supposed to ask. Okay, um taylor every week we love to ask our author death Um for a writing tip and really what we just want to know is how do we write a book that stays on the list for 10 weeks and then and really gets sold to Hollywood, could you just like really quickly? I think any of you ladies need help. I think you're all doing pretty well. Um but but I, I hear you on the writing tip, I think the thing for me um that I have had it, it's something that I've learned from reading some of the women that I just love, Madeline Miller comes to mind is a great example of which is you know, write the story that only you know, how to write that uniquely you know, you you are uniquely right for and and I think I've found that um in writing about fame, I think I found my lane that thing that feels like I know how to do this and not everybody knows this world and I think what Madeleine does with greek myth again when we're talking about, you know, is like she has a unique talent to understand both the classical mythology and the academic aspects of what she's writing about and the ability to write an immensely readable, hugely emotional, tender Sophie great literary piece and so she is doing this thing that feels...

...like unapologetically who she is and I show up for that every time, even if it's a even if I was a person who's like, I don't know if I like greek myth, you read Sir C and you are in the hands of the only person who could tell you a story that one out. So that's what I'm trying to do. And with every next book I'm trying to think not just like what's a good idea, but what am I so excited about? Only I right now can do this. Yeah, that's a good thing. I love that. Yeah, so that is a great tip and I'm just going to go off and write my next, you know, 10 weeks on the new york times list bestseller immediately after this show. That sounds great. Only you could Right? Yeah, exactly. I should have it down by about three a.m. no problem. Taylor do you have a book you'd like to recommend that you've read recently that you think we might like? I do. I um just finished I have been talking about this book to anyone that will listen to me. I think it is the perfect book for people to read if they liked Malibu Rising and it's the perfect book for people to read if they're super into j lo and Ben Affleck right now, which is next called, The View is exhausting. It's by Michaela Conlin, uh sorry, that's not right. Michaela Clements and Anjali Data and it's about a list actress, she's got a scandal in order to whether her scandal in the public eye. She takes up with her like friend playboy, you know, once crush, um because the public loves it when they're together. And so the two of them are gonna go on yachts all around wherever uh and try to look like this is a real relationship to get her out of some hot water, but I wonder if that's what J Lo is doing. I know, I know, we don't know, we don't know. It's like kind of for Aniston and David Schwimmer after All the Friends where you been stunning. I don't know, but it's if that kind of stuff, if you like to find out this book is just super cool, super fun. Just like just a knockout, awesome, great recommendation. Okay, all right, taylor, we have to have some announcements and busy work, but you're not going anywhere please because we have another question for you, but saying with all of you out there, but first we want to remind you all of you out there. One of my favorite things that we do besides this live show is our podcasts and not only is the show of podcast, but every single friday we have a new writer's block podcast with our rock star Librarian Ron block and it is so much fun and it's totally different from the show. So if you like hanging out with us here, you will love hanging out with us there. This past week, Ron talk to y two more and lisa Donovan about the art of writing memoirs and it was a really powerful episode. And this week Ron is talking to Monica West and wanda Morris about diverse voices in publishing and I've listened to both of those and you do not want to miss them. Um So excited, those are going to be awesome. Alright now Book Club, you know, we talk about it every week, but if you are not hanging out with us yet in the Friends and Fiction Official Book Club, you are missing out. So the group which is separate from us and is run by our friends, lisa Harrison and Brenda Gartner is now more than 8000 strong. So on sunday at Seven Eastern, the Book Club will be celebrating their one year anniversary. Um And then on monday I will be joining them to discuss The Forest Vanishing Stars, my brand new novel. And on september 20th patty will be joining to discuss one of her classic much loved novels. The bookshop Atwater's end. Yeah. And we want to remind you that our bookseller of the week. This week is book soup in L. A. And for don't forget to check them out. Um they've got some deals and we hope that you will join us next week at seven. Uh we're gonna talk about debut novels and uh we love talking about debuts, they're the newbies and you're going to meet our special guests a gun you might have heard of, I don't know, lou diamond phillips. There you go. He's written a book, How cool is that job, Havert, Haggerty and Addison Armstrong. Then in two weeks join us as we welcome Karin Slaughter who wrote the best selling new novel false witness. I am reading it and it's keeping me up. You know when you read Karin Slaughter, you don't dare close your eyes and when you have her on the...

...show but just be you, you be ready for a costume drama, that's all I can tell you. Um, also that same night how he's going to share her trailer for once upon a wardrobe and you don't want to miss that if you're ever wondering about our schedule because there's a lot to keep up with. We can't even keep up with it all. It's always on the friends and fiction website as well as a sidebar with events on our Friends in fiction facebook page. Okay, last announcement, um you guys might have heard that mary Kay patty and I all have winter books coming out this year and if you want to be the very first to read them, make sure that you check out our winter Wonderland subscription box with Nantucket Book partners. Um you'll receive the books just as they're released, they're all signed first editions along with a really awesome friends of fiction coffee mug and reads and hot chocolate that you cannot get anywhere else. It's available exclusively through our friends and and tuck it Book partners. And and of course tonight our friends at book soup are offering us 10% off Malibu rising in any of our new novels with the Code B. K. S. F. F. And that's 10% off. Get your hands on Malibu rising if you don't have it yet. And uh think about that winter Wonderland subscription box. I'm just saying uh I want to visit book suit in the past couple times. I've been in L. A. I've meant to go and haven't been able to go. So I'm putting that on my to do list. Yeah, taylor I know we talked a lot about your history and moving to Hollywood, but a question that I love that we all love and our listeners due to is a little bit of insight into why you became a writer, which is what were the values around reading and writing in your childhood and how do you feel like those might have translated into you becoming the writer that you are. Um you know, I love this question. And and part of the reason I love this question because I think a lot of times the answer is you know oh big readers more kids or uh you know there's at least my mom's middle library week. Um That's not me. I was put in front of the tv you know it was the last wow. Um And so I felt I fell in love with reading as a teenager. I I came to it. My grandmother loved to read and my mom actually loves to read. It was just you know you're a single mom you got a lot to do you know? Um And so when I was a teenager my mom started bringing me to the bookstore and I remember she would she would like pick out a book and and then I was like I don't know if I like it or not. She's like can't because you're choosing those ones with those like fancy little vague covers. She's like you go for V. C. Andrews, you go come on you know and she really she really taught me um and my grandmother did to you know like how you know you're just gonna get a knockout book. And so I came to it a little bit later but have fallen in love with it all the same. Wait I cannot let you leave taylor until I ask you a burning question. That's burning in my heart. This is making me nervous time for me to uh We're all holding our breath. Okay what is your favorite Cary Grant movie? Alright that's very easy for me to answer. It's an affair to remember. That's awesome. Okay, how about yours mary. Kay, well I have a hard time between charade. Mm. Uh Well charade kind of says it all to me rate is a very good one charade and there's another, what's the other one? Oh gosh there's another one I'm sort of in that Audrey Hepburn. Um Oh bringing up baby is greatly yeah, that's a little early for me though. I just love what I really love about charade is how much older he was then. Audrey Pepper and he knew it was inappropriate and you feel awkward about it but I think that made it more charming to me. It's just a great movie. North by Northwest is another one. It is, it's great. Yeah. Story. His girl friday. I mean you can't you can't miss Yeah, I have a lot of movie watching to do. I was gonna say I don't have a pen near me. I'm like ok, I'll give you the list. Okay, well thank You. And to everyone out there we really encourage you to grab Taylor's new novel, Mallaby rising and how could you not with all you just heard and hopefully from a book seller of the week book Soup that is offering 10% off. So thank you so much for visiting us tonight. Taylor. It was such a treat. You were an amazing guy. Thank you for helping me. This is so cool You guys do and I'm just really flattered me included. So thank you. Well, thank you have a great night. Thank I thank you. That was amazing. All right. Everyone stick...

...around. We'll see you in a minute at the sip and stay with story point after show in the summer of Story points. Say that 10 times fast. Good luck at the same time. Same place as we welcome our special debut novelists guests. That was great! Oh my gosh, that was so awesome. Thank you guys and welcome everyone to our sip into our story points, sip and stay after show the wine that loves stories as much as we do. So I wanted to like her a lot and I do, I was really nervous because like she's one of those authors that like to me, I mean, I mean she is a celeb but you know how we just, they're different authors that hit us all different ways and I was like, oh my gosh, I'm hosting and but I feel the same patty is like sometimes you meet someone and you're like, oh, she isn't as great as I thought she. Yeah, she is so great that she was one of my favorite, authentic. I felt like I was like leading a whole show to be like, okay, all right. I mean like this, I need to write that down. This is so great. Like it's probably one that I'll rewatch. I thought she was an incredible guests. Yeah, I always say don't meet your heroes. Yeah, sometimes your heroes don't disappoint you. Like when you met to graft in right? I think about that I met Sarah Jessica Parker. I was terrified because I loved sex in the city so much. I was scared when I met her that she wasn't going to live up to buy huge expectations, but she was fantastic. So yeah, I think we had that experience tonight with taylor. She was for sure Patty, do you have anybody like that? Like anyone that you were like nervous to me? And then I do, I mean there's a couple of people, one was Pat Conroy for sure, you know, um and then of course, you know we became dear friends, but the other one was the singer Amy Grant, your immigrant and I and I was in college. I mean I played her music until the tape broke baby. I just I okay, I'm not going for the high notes and I think um I mean I saw her at the armory and party, I saw her at the armory in Auburn when in 1982 And she's only a couple years older than me. So she was maybe in her 20's and um meeting her is was you know, she is exactly what who and what she seems to be and I loved that. That's awesome. How about you chrissy? Um this is going to make you laugh. but you? Yeah, like when I became an author, you were one of my first, like, I mean, I truly remember like me like going to the event that we were doing and finding out that I was doing a panel with you. And at that point, I mean, it was only my first book, but I had done a lot of speaking events, it wasn't nervous about speaking, but I was like, I can't be on a panel with paddy kelly and henri, like, I'll be too nervous and I'll say something stupid and you know, whatever. And then and then fast forward two days and we were singing show tunes on the floor of the hotel room and drinking champagne out of a bottle out of the bottle. I mean, you know the rest is history. Yeah, I didn't want to say anything, but she kind of lived up to my expectations. I if you're going to tell the whole story and then go and you know what, you didn't do it for me didn't happen. I mean, I forgot her name. I go, right, right, Kirsten telling me what, what's your name? Kathy Kathy Christie happy christmas, remember it was so funny. Like you were like taking care of us because we had that long weekend and you were like, okay, here's your emergent, your vitamin C remember that I brought you a parent like that hilarious. It sounds like a great patty. Really? It was really hilarious. Huh? All right. Kristen we're dying to know. Did you survive the first day of kindergarten? Yes. Um You know, of course, like anybody dropping their kids off at kindergarten the first day I was all teary after you get out of the car, right? Like I saved it till after he was out of sight. Um, I was very emotional. He had a great first day. He hopped right out of the car and walked in, no fear. I was so proud of him. He had a, yeah, he had a great first day and a great second day today. And it's all going really well. Thank you for asking. How are you doing? Oh, I was like a puddle of emotions on the floor yesterday. I was a disaster. But, but you know what keep he's a great kid and...

...it's a great school and um, I'm so it could not have turned out better so far at least. So the first two days are great. We've done it now and can we quit? Makes it because he has a great mom. So you all remember the first day you dropped your kids off at school. I mean, mine was in the dinosaur age. I can hardly remember. I remember the more is an impression than like the actual physical. I remember that gut level feeling that she's talking about, but I don't and, but Christie you just did it a couple of years ago. Yeah. Well, I actually really remember two year old preschool, like the very most like he did one of those little, you know, two day weeks like programs or whatever. And the really hilarious thing was, I remember dropping him off and he was very uncertain and he really didn't want to go when he wasn't really sure. And then he ended up loving it. He had a great time. But the funny thing was they had a rule where you couldn't like bring you, brought your snack or whatever, but you couldn't bring like stuffed animals or levees or you know, because you would have to, they would have to keep up with them. And he was going through this huge mickey and Minnie phase. And so we lived really close to the preschool and so I'd stroll into preschool in the morning and he had his little mickey and Minnie and I was like, no, we get to school. You know, we have to take him home. And so I was like, just so upset. You know, when I left, I was like, I am a little baby is too little. Like I shouldn't have done this is Carolina. And, and so I'm walking down the street with the stroller when my friend stops and she's like, you know how you look right now with an empty stroller with a mickey and Minnie stuffed animal in it. Right. I just started dying laughing and it like totally, she was like, it's a little suspect, like someone's going to call the police. This is a, I guess it's amazing. I wish we had a photo of that. We have a photo actually we do, it's not a can scratch it up. And there she took a photo and since I Andy, who is going to be 35 in september um, Katie, his big sister, who, who was four years older, she went right off to preschool, you know, to run it basically to tell when he is what we do, what we do, let's have some charts. But Andrew not so much. And so, uh, he was in a mother's morning out and I was, I was working full time as a newspaper reporter. I had a housekeeper and so her, her job was to get to the house or pick him up from, pick both of them up from school and bring them home. And so um, the preschool, Katie had already gone through, she was four years old. And as I said, she came out of the womb an adult. Andrew not so much. I got it. Oh and so I had been involved with the school and I'd actually been on the little kindergarten or preschool board. I got a call from the school and they said, Kathy, you need to come yet. Andrew. And I said, oh my God, what happened? And they said, well, uh, he won't stop crying. The only way he will stop crying is if the teacher holds him in her lap and it's hard for her preschool With, you know, 12 four year old with Eleanor because he was convinced we were not coming back for him. He was, he was thinking it was like taken or something. So his sister loves to tournament with like dude, you flunked out of preschool. No. Oh sweet Andy but wait, we want to know about MK A vacay. How long you did so many things like vacations in one. Hey, it's crazy. We've been trapped at home for so long. I just said, I want to go somewhere different. I want to, I want, I don't want to be hot and it was hot in New England. So we went to, we flew into boston. I've never been to Fenway. I wanted, you know, tom loves makes sense, liam Neeson to rescue Andrew from preschool. Uh, meg and you know what? She's sitting there with her mom Kathy and that's probably from Cathy. Cathy's hanging her off. We flew into boston. We went through a red sox game at Fenway. Um, but I have to tell you my favorite part. So we went to the Isabella Stewart Gardner Museum, you know where the big the art heist happened. Um, which is why it was fascinating to me because they stole stuff And, but after after the game we left early because it's starting to rain. We went for drinks and late dinner at the Fairmont Plaza, Copley Fairmont Plaza, you know right on Copley Square and it was so chic and fun and the the most delicious truffle...

...fries you've ever tasted. Then we went to Nantucket and um went to Nantucket and we went to dinner and drinks at you know Elin Hilderbrand House. We do have one that's the one that someone who was as um like I remember thinking wow, she's like really really nice the first time. I yeah, definitely. So um yeah we went to dinner and drinks at her house, it was like being in a nancy meyer movie the whole time and did a signing at Mitchell's with our darling tim um from Mitchell's and um that was great and we have a you know we had some delightful dinners, had drinks with um nat Philbrick who is a friend of of ours and meg's, he writes amazing narrative nonfiction history books. Um Such a great guy. We met his dog Dora and uh had lunch with Nancy Fair and her husband and then as one does and then tuck it and then we have drinks with patty's agent. Uh Really? Yeah, so we did the whole and then we uh tim from uh from Nantucket Book partners, very generously offered us his jeep and we roamed around the island and got to places we wouldn't have gotten to see. So it was great. And we went we went back and went to a um Cape cod league baseball game and it was like being in small pack patty and I both used to do those games when we were kids. It's like being in small town America, you know the seventh inning stretch, everybody stands up and things take me out to the ballgame and they raffled, they really made popsicles and popular and blanket, they raffled off a washer dryer as they do as you do. Which which team did you go see Kathy we are friend was helping coach the hyenas harbor hawks. It was so we were in new Orleans, the Orleans card or the cardinals that there's the ones we used to go see to that is so funny. I know we're all connected in 1000 ways. Somebody kicked Christy off. But I'm sorry, I feel like you're Nantucket vacation. Meg just wrote, MK takes Nantucket she came, she saw she conquered. I mean when I saw the picture you and tim, I was jealous of yep, Ellen nat. But when I saw you having drinks with my agent, I mean I got that stab of jealousy man, seriously Foma Well we had, we had fun and we did discuss you and then we went to, we went to um southwest New Hampshire and stay nice. Stay with old friends from ST Pete who own an in and we sat on the village green in this little town of Fitzwilliam and we listened to a traditional six piece irish band, Send us the shot of it with the music. And I kept hitting, play, play play. So Christie just texted and said um that her computer just totally crashed. But Sean is saying that he has the picture, show it Sean. I got mad. Mad. I'm mad. But who is surprised that Christie looks like a supermodel on her child's first day of preschool? I mean she looks like the like a model of like model looking up madness. Oh my God, I looked like I was like one step away from being admitted to a mental asylum. Like an insane is look today stroller with making um any kind of does lend that they're too does that for her. Yeah. Alright. Since we lost our leader for the night, I guess we should. But Kathy mary, Kay, Kathy, we missed you and I we loved living vicariously through you. The pictures were great. The B and B for sale. We just talk about the wine. My wine is out. That's why we have to have to go. We need some more story point. All right. And this is you know, we have a pitiful way. Are they taking us out? Know what? I don't we're still here. So what I just was going to say that um you know what summer without some story point. Yeah, and some stories well. And you know, the chardonnay is so nice right now. But as we head into fall, we can start sipping the red wine. Is the nights get a little bit cooler, right? I always worry with the red wine now...

I'm gonna spill it on myself or spill it on my nice cream colored carpet in here. This just, I'm always scared of my own self, but I love how that they want. Just blocking me out. There you go, switch it out. Oh, all right, thank you Story point. Thanks y'all. This was so much fun. It's really great. Alright, love you ladies. Night tonight we later gators. Yeah, thank you for tuning in, join us every week on facebook or Youtube Where our live show airs every Wednesday night at seven p.m. eastern time and please subscribe to our podcast and follow us on instagram. We're so glad you're here.

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